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To: El Gato
Grenades are not "arms"? Someone tell the Army and Marines.

I believe they are classified as "munitions", not "arms".

81 posted on 04/27/2007 11:12:23 AM PDT by Teacher317 (Are you familiar with the writings of Shan Yu?)
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To: Teacher317

Actually a grenade (homemade or military) is classified as a destructive device. No different than a pipe bomb.

I support the 2nd amendment and I don’t feel paranoid or even upset by the fact that I cannot possess grenades or pipe bombs with my firearms.

My firearms can be used for defense, hunting, or target shooting. I really see no legitimate use for explosive devices designed to create shrapnel.

That is the problem with articles like this. The author obviously had a slant on the story that did not focus on the important things we would all understand such as:

IED’s - yes, the same thing they use in Iraq albeit on a smaller scale.

Marijuana grow operation - not that big a deal to me but it’s still illegal

Boobytraps??? - The response on this board is almost always unanimous when a pit bull maims or kills a child. I wonder how many would defend a “militia member” if a child or firefighter stumbled on one of these things?


84 posted on 04/27/2007 11:37:31 AM PDT by volunbeer (Dear heaven.... we really need President Reagan again!)
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To: Teacher317
Teacher317 said: I believe they are classified as "munitions", not "arms".

What do you suppose was the object of the SALT talks with the Soviet Union? As in, "Strategic Arms Limitation Treaty"?

95 posted on 04/27/2007 1:51:50 PM PDT by William Tell (RKBA for California (rkba.members.sonic.net) - Volunteer by contacting Dave at rkba@sonic.net)
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To: Teacher317
I believe they are classified as "munitions", not "arms".

"Munitions" is a synonym for "arms".

The DoD definition is:

"Material used in war, especially weapons and ammunition." That's also the dictionary definition;. So unless you think that H.R. 1022 is Constitutionally Correct, I'd say that you'd best support the notion that grenades, and other weapons, are "arms", the keeping and bearing of which is protected by the Second Amendment.

Thesaurus.com gives this definition and synonyms for "arms":

Definition: weaponry
Synonyms: accoutrements, armaments, artillery, equipment, firearms, guns, munitions, ordnance, panoply, weapons

Interestingly it also gives for "arms control":

Definition: weapons reduction
Synonyms: arms limitation, arms reduction, defense cuts, gun control, nonproliferation

We can pretty confident that the term "arms" included cannon and cannon armed warships at the time the second amendment was passed. Grenades were thrown by grenadiers as early as the 17th century, and probably much earlier even though the terms had not yet been invented, there is some history to indicate that grenades were in use as early as the Ming Dynasty in China. They are weapons that an individual soldier can carry (bear) and use. They are arms. True they are not guns, but then neither is a sword, which was the metaphor of choice of the many of the founding fathers, for example:

"The militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birthright of an American... The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state government, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people"
(Tench Coxe, Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788)"

98 posted on 04/27/2007 7:56:03 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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