Posted on 04/20/2007 11:58:21 PM PDT by the scotsman
KATRINA SYNDROME
Defines otherwise able bodied people who have lost
the ability to defend themselves as well as their
instinct to survive due to induced dependence upon a
government, parent or other social system.
I always learn something when Star Traveler speaks.
You said — “Maybe because instinct cautions you not to be the first member of a prey group to stick a head up, possibly drawing the lethal attentions of your predator.”
Actually that’s a very good natural instinct for survival, I would say — unless you are assured that you can immediately overpower the “predator”. The only other possibility is to plan as a group to do something knowing that someone will lose their life — but that it’s the only possible solution for the survival of many (like in the Todd Beemer case [the “let’s roll!” guy]).
Regards,
Star Traveler
4) Why don’t people act in predictable, rational ways when confronted by SHOCKING, TRAUMATIC VIOLENCE?
Good question.
Survival is an aggressive motivator. Even in shock people
in a burning building will try to escape. Something’s not
right here.
The really bad thing about this is that often, this kind of snyaptically vacant nonsense comes from those who THINK (if we can be that broad with the term) they are defending conservativism and more importantly, its basis in Christian thought from the heathen muslims. I personally have a ton of problems with Islam. I think it is satanic, hateful, hegemonistic, fascist and totalitarian. I think it does great great harm to those who follow it. HOWEVER, I also have some very dear friends who are Muslim, and I love them heartily. I find them to be wonderful people, who credit their AMAZING hospitality and warmth to their devout Muslim faith. We have had the beginnings of conversations about God, sin, the basis for forgiveness, how God views sinners and other great topics. I love them. How can that be? It is because I KNOW THAT THEY ARE MADE IN THE IMAGE OF GOD. That leads me to think, when I hear of a Muslim laying down his life for another student to hope it IS true, rather than feel compelled to find some reason why it is NOT true. Being a follower of a false religion, even so pernicious a religion as Islam, does not make people into demons, worthy of our hate. It does often bring about many hateful things in them, and yes, I get pissed off beyond words when I see some of the stuff those people do. I hope that the wrath of MEN hits them before the wrath of GOD does. HOWEVER, the people who are posting this crap about "well, they are Muslims, so we just can't know" are guilty of the same irrational and stupid hatred as the Imam teaching palestinian children that glory awaits by blowing yourself up as a "martyr." If these people are professing Christians (many on FR are), then they are functional heretics who are denying doctrine the image of God, whether they articulate it or not.
Finally, you don't fight hatred with hatred. I believe in the existence of evil and that it must be met with force (it will not be stopped by reason, or by taking another toke and singing Kum bay yah). However attempting to justify your own hatred by simply citing that of Islam is not just stupid, it is morally wrong.
These folks should be ashamed of themselves.
Yes Star Traveler is so helpful and a great instructor...
Thanks ST...
FROM POST #210 - Similar to your comment.
[...why does the headline identify him as “Muslim”? “Muslim is not used in the headline when acts of terror are committed here and abroad.
Also, would the headline have been “Christian student gives life to save others”? Why is this person being identified by his religion?
I do not believe they used the word “Jew” to describe the professor who was a hero. Holocaust surivivor, but they didn’t say “Jewish hero”...]
Well, thank you both... now I’m going to go and hide... :-)
I meant that I agreed with Dallas59 in that I am not so quick to buy into the Waleed-was-a-hero chanting that the article is claiming, and that the cultural background is for the most part not inclined to provide any manner of incentive for actions such as alluded to therein (the article).
Who killed the thread?
http://weaselhead.org/sounds/asprwf/cd_field_cricket_01.wav
You said — “I love them. How can that be? It is because I KNOW THAT THEY ARE MADE IN THE IMAGE OF GOD. That leads me to think, when I hear of a Muslim laying down his life for another student to hope it IS true, rather than feel compelled to find some reason why it is NOT true.”
Hmmm..., so many things...
Okay, do you “love them straight to hell?” By that I mean, do you tell them that their religion is of the devil, a religion of death and if they persist in it, they will end up going straight to hell and they will not find the forgiveness that is in Jesus Christ — who says He is the *only way* to God, the Father?
And talking about that Muslim “laying down his life” — do you realize that you just said that this so-called Muslim (assuming that he was) — just laid down his life for Satan??!! That’s whose company he’s going to end up in. How did laying down his life do him *one bit of good*? It would have done him absolutely no good.
ACTUALLY, when I hear of a Muslim student “laying down his life” for someone else — *I hope to God is ISN’T true!!*
I mean, why on earth would you want to wish that a Muslim go straight to hell? That simply doesn’t make sense. When you “wish” and “hope” that it’s true that a Muslim did such a thing — you’ve just wished him right into Satan’s hands. And you call that a *good thing*!!?? Hmmm..., something is wrong here... You’re talking absolute “double-speak” here. It’s like “Oh, the Muslim is such a good person for saving this guy’s life and I’m just so overjoyed that he’s now in the Devil’s hands!!” Sure..., you do make a whole lot of sense..., don’t you...
You’re just way off base here, with the “Religion of Death” — Islam. It’s nothing but a Satanic religion and all who are in it and follow it are doomed straight to hell. And you’re apparently glad to see them end up there, I see...
Regards,
Star Traveler
You don’t hear those noises up in Washington do you? I mean in Oregon I rarely hear them. But you sure do in Texas and Oklahoma... :-)
Right now I’m hearing bullfrogs from our pond. It’s a peaceful sound. Why no crickets out here?
[...talking about that Muslim “laying down his life” — do you realize that you just said that this so-called Muslim (assuming that he was) — just laid down his life for Satan??!!...]
As usual another excellent point.
Nope.
Ok.
Not sure why no crickets. I just know having come back to Texas and Oklahoma for a while that it’s *so noisy* out here in the evenings...
Oh, and one more thing. The birds are noisier in Texas and Oklahoma than they are in Oregon and Washington. It’s true. I didn’t notice it myself, until my cousin came out to Oregon and stayed for a few years. She said that it was so quiet withthe birds. They were subdued. So, I didn’t think about it too much, until I came back to Oklahoma and Texas. So, I listened — and sure enough, they are noisier around here.
Strange for sure...
“Our main goal is (and always has been) to stabilize the region in the interest of national security. Liberation for the Iraqis isn’t the goal (warm and fuzzy though it may sound), but a welcome byproduct of the goal.
Iow, the Iraqis weren’t liberated for liberation’s sake. There are plenty of oppressed peoples around the world that aren’t on our radar for liberation-intervention. Why? Because doing so isn’t in our national security interest.”
I couldn’t help but notice that you failed to address why we are currently spending billions to rebuild Iraq.
Saddam Hussein is removed from power and we have already assured ourselves that WMD no longer exist in Iraq. The Iraqis have an elected government and a constitution through the auspices of the US.
Of the top 15 nations currently receiving US foreign aid, 6 are Muslim nations and that doesn’t even include Iraq. Egypt is number 2, Afghanistan is number 3, Pakistan is number 4, Sudan is number 6, Jordan is number 7, and Indonesia is number 13. Nigeria, a half Muslim nation is number 15.
I have just given you a description of my activity with them. Why is it that some freepers seem to be obsessed with the idea that if you actually love men who are unbelievers that you must somehow be shading the doctrine of sin and judgment? When I open John 3:16, I DON'T read that "God so hated the bastards that He sent his only son so that we could rub our hands in glee as they reject the truth and thus perish forever." Yeah. Like you said "so many things"
And talking about that Muslim “laying down his life” — do you realize that you just said that this so-called Muslim (assuming that he was) — just laid down his life for Satan??!!
You have such a twisted and unbiblical view of men in their sin (and correspondingly men in a state of grace). The fact is, that the bible teaches that EVERY act of ALL men is full of evil and foully offensive to God. The very best that a converted Christian can do is so full of sin that it will send him straight to hell. It is not "them" who need forgiveness, it is "us." "We" just realize it (although sometimes I wonder if this is so). That said (the ancients called this the doctrine of total depravity, and I have a ton of scripture references if you need), this does not mean that the image of God, which is full of goodness, nobility, courage, grace, love and mercy is ERADICATED. It is there in ALL men. Calvin likened it to a bombed out cathedral, showing both the glory and the ravages of destruction. It is entirely possible that the image of God was on full display for the world and that some Muslim student DID emulate God himself in laying down his life for a friend. Romans 5 says clearly that this is possible for men to do. You pervert the doctrine of the image of God and you do so from a shallow, self-righteous judgmental understanding of what it means to be one of God's own. There was another group who shared that "us" vs "them" view in the 1st century. They were the "set apart" ones. You may have heard of them. The word "set apart" is from the Hebrew word "divided." The word is "peres" and the party was the "peres" ees. Ever hear of them? Yeah. The party who thought they were so holy (Pharisees) and everyone else was scum finally got so fed up with God they killed him when he actually showed up. "Imagine! telling US we are as bad as THEM" Some things just have not changed in 2000 years it seems.
Are you trying to make a rhetorical point about "I mean, why on earth would you want to wish that a Muslim go straight to hell? " or are you truly unable to distinguish between me wishing for his death (which I do not), and wishing that since he did die and go to face his judge, that he left this world reflecting as much of the image of God as is possible for him to do? Do you truly not see the difference between the two?
When I was a heathen myself, I HATED prim, smug, self righteous "Christians" who looked down their religious noses at me and my hell raising drug taking wild ass ways. It was later when I discovered that Jesus is not like many of his moralist pharisee followers that I fell in love with HIM. It is still much harder to love his church at times. This is one of those times. I think you know why, which is why you deliberately omit and misconstrue my posted analysis of Islam. Of course Islam is a religion of death. It is because it refuses to humbly accept the righteousness of Christ, and seeks to establish and rely on a righteousness of one's own. So, then, is "Christianity" (not the real thing, but the moralistic drivel in the name of Christ) at times a religion of death, even while calling itself life.
I have to admit, you can spin a good yarn ...
From a few second hand words you’ve recreated the entire crime scene with positions and timing, explaining all the actions that you have no idea took place or not.
But it seems as if you are taking it as truth that the story as writen is true - “A” really does believe that Waleed saved his life.
So it boils down to YOUR belief that it could not have possibly REALLY happened that way, and you create the yarn to fit your concept of what must be real.
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