Posted on 04/04/2007 5:20:44 AM PDT by BlackJack
They were young cannon fodder -- sent by the Argentinian junta to win a war against the British 25 years ago. They were ill-equipped, starving and their own officers were their worst enemies.
Dug into muddy trenches, they fought over every rotting biscuit. They secretly stole sheep from the islanders and, unable to make a fire -- it was wartime, after all -- they devoured the meat raw. "The months on the islands have marked us for life," says 45-year-old Norberto Santos.
Forty-four-year-old Gabriel Sagasfume lost the soles of his feet to frostbite in the trenches: The military didn't have enough boots and many recruits were sent to war in just loafers or sandals. A total of 450 Argentinian Falklands veterans have commited suicide since the war -- more than died during the actual fighting.
Ernesto Alonso went to Stanley with two of his friends in November, courtesy of Chilean national television. At Mount Longon, where the decisive battle was fought and where most soldiers died, he climbed into the same muddy hole that was his refuge during the war. He found his rusty soldier's cutlery and a dented water bottle, which he took back with him.
In Stanley he met Carol Thatcher by chance -- the daughter of former British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher -- who was shooting a documentary film on "Mummy's War."
He posed in front of the camera with some British veterans, who were all highly decorated. "But where are your medals?" the British asked the Argentinian veterans.
(Excerpt) Read more at spiegel.de ...
Interesting article. Hopefully the message has gotten out out that 3rd world militaries are quite effective when it comes to intimidating their own people but they should never pick a fight with a real military again. Wait a minute, I have to take that back. Iran is treating Britain like an inflatable love doll. Nice going Tony. Maggie has bigger b@lls than you.
I was working in Argentina when the Falklands War broke out. A lot of this doesn’t surprise me. General Galtieri needed a distraction from the high unemployment and high inflation of the day. He first tried to stir up a long-running border dispute with Peru over some disputed land on the southern tip of South America and, when Peru didn’t bite, the British conveniently came along with the Falkland Islands controversy.
Amazingly, what I recall of the story is that an Argentine demolition company had been hired to tear down a building on one of the islands. In a moment of pride, the Argentines put up an Argentine flag at the demolition site which some of the islanders objected to. The islanders wanted the demolition company kicked off the island and, from there, the donnybrook was on.
In my job down there, I was working with the Argentine Navy. As a former US Navy sailor, I was a rather shocked at the way conscripts in Argentina were treated. Essentially, in those days, a military truck would drive around and pick young, 18 year-old men up and take them to an induction center. They would be processed in, handed some uniforms, and taken to a ship or military base. No training; don’t pass Go or collect $200 - they went directly to a command. Their minimum enlistment was 4 years. If they did well and decided they wanted to stay in the Navy, they could reenlist and, at that point, would be eligible for training.
I also recall how General Galtieri lied to the country about the progress of the war. He routinely claimed that the Argentine forces were defeating the Brits and made a huge deal out of their only real achievement in the war - sinking the British destroyer (or cruiser, I’ve long since forgotten which) with an Exocet missile. Before the war ended with the defeat of the Argentines, I was sent back to the US. I can’t begin to imagine what a stunning shock it must have been for the Argentines when they found out that they lost a war that their president (General Galtieri) told them they were winning.
So, it’s not hard to believe this story. It all fits with the experiences I had and the events I witnessed at the time. Unfortunate event in the history of the world.
I suspect you mean Chile, the traditional enemy of Argentina.
Peru and Argentina don’t share a border.
I saw that too and thought it was BS. Ronny was never going to let Maggie down. Never. Outside of logistical support the Brits managed pretty good on their own.
It seems that there are three main types of armies:
Show troops, intended for display, such as the Buckingham Palace or Swiss Guards. (Some of these are also real fighters.) Most European troops appear to be drifting in this direction. Intended to look like an army more than to BE an army.
Regime support troops. By definition, this group includes all 3rd-world and dictatorial regime armies. Their primary purpose is to keep the regime in power (or on occasion to overthrow and replace it.) They are essentially heavily armed police.
Fighting troops which are optimized to fight and defeat other armies. This includes most notably the Israeli, US and Australian armies, and the Brits, although they seem to be heading in the show troop direction.
The problem is that optimizing the effectiveness of your army for any one of these missions tends to interfere with its effectiveness in fulfilling either of the others.
The US was exceptionally effective at destroying the Iraqi army, but has been much less competent in a regime support mode, for which they are neither trained nor equipped.
As you say, few 3rd world armies, optimized almost entirely for a show or regime support mode, have a hope of standing up against a fighting army.
His greatest fear was not for those......he said to the man, they had heard the Gurkhas were coming and they looked for the first person to surrender to when they saw the British Marines.....hahahahahahahaha...
funny story, but I've seen them in Indonesian jungles doing their thing.....nasty little bastards....and very, very, good soldiers..... very good soldiers.
This is why guys like Chavez are winning the hearts and minds of most South Americans. The class gap between the rich and poor are extreme including the attitudes of the elites toward the poor. Most of the officiers come from rich classes and the promotion system favors them due to political connections of their families. I met a number of these officers when I was in the military. When US officers go thru the tactical training (i.e mud and dirt) many of these Third World officers sit it out. One explained to me that in their country officers are from the gentry class and they are not suppose to get down and dirty. I can imagine how they view their conscript soldiers who come mainly from the poor and farming class. I have read accounts of the Falkland War and reading how the Argentine officers stayed and slept in Port Stanley (the only major town/port on the island) and phoned their instructions and orders of the day to their soldiers who slept in the foxholes in the wintry nights (in that region winter is like the weather in Canada) did not surprise me at all. When the British paras and SAS assualted the hilly perimeters of Port Stanley near the end of the war, no Argentine officer was with their troops to command and lead them, except for a few conciencious junior officers. The only exception was the Argentine Marines. The Marine battalion sent to the Falklands was brokened up and dispersed amongst the Argentinian Army troops made up mainly of freshly trained conscripts in order to shore up their fighting ability. During the battle the Brits reported that the Argentine Marines sang their nations national anthem during battle, and stopped when most of them were killed or wounded.
Nah-UNH!!!
Yes, you are correct. I don't know why I want to put Peru in the middle of this dispute.
(It's Chile, Dusty, CHILE, ok!!?? [mumbling] Chile, Chile . . . Per, uh, . . . CHILE . . . Chile, Chile . . . . . . . )
“He first tried to stir up a long-running border dispute with Peru over some disputed land on the southern tip of South America and, when Peru didn’t bite, the British conveniently came along with the Falkland Islands controversy.”
Don’t you mean Chile? Argentina and Peru do not share a border.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Next time you see a picture of the palace guards note that they are toting modern battle rifles. Those guys come out of the battalions of the Guards Brigade----Coldstream Guards; Irish Guards; Welsh Guards; Grenadier Guards; Horse Guards and such. Kind of like the US troops at Arlington Cemetery or the Marines at Eighth and I in Washington.
Agreed. As I noted, some show troops are battle soldiers before they become showmen. All the troops you mention, plus the Swiss Guards of the Vatican all fall into this category.
I’ve always thought it would be cool if an assassin got past the perimeter at the Vatican, charged at the pope, and got taken out with a halberd.
There was no way the UK was going to lose in the Fauklands. Argentina had nothing that made them a threat, a handful of exocets (sp) and a few fighters... their air force was shredded in days, and their Exocets were spent just as rapidly... tragically they did take out a Cruiser I believe, the only significant damage they managed in the conflict.
Now, had Argentina been able to truly wage an extended war, Britain would have had difficulty... resupply, equipment, etc was a difficult task, and they were from my understanding already beginning to feel the strain of trying to run a war by boat by the end of the conflict. I think it helped to open the UK’s eyes on how far they had let their military lapse.
However I really don’t think there was any real risk of Britain losing, just a matter of how long it would take. Fortunately their first attack did last long enough to end it... A war of attrition would have been bad for the UK in such a scenario as the faulklands.
See my reply #13.
Thanks for relating your experiences. Sounds incredible that
the recruits got so little traning!
Yeah....Gurkhas have a reputation for slitting throats.
I wouldn’t want to mess with them myself lol.
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