[spunkets]

Hey all you athiests, when you can answer what the "first mover" was.... then you can claim logic backs your stand.... until then.. doesn't matter if you are militant or not... you do not hold the "intellectual and scientific" high ground no matter how much you think you do. What caused the first movement?

The physics always was. This world appears as a phase transition in a physical existence that always was. There is no need, nor is there any evidence whatsoever that a prime mover is needed.

[HamiltonJay]

Nope... try again.

Currently science first mover fallback goes under current theory to the big bang..

Assuming this is true, you are still left with what caused the big bang?

You cannot get to where we are without tracing back how it got here, and science nor logic get you there.