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To: KeyesPlease
"Are you arguing that the original intent of the Constitution is to apply against the states too?"

His argument is that the Supremacy Clause applies the U.S. Constitution and all the amendments, including the Bill of Rights, to the states from the time of ratification.

Yes, I realize that's crazy, especially given the wording of the Preamble to the Bill of Rights, the actual purpose of the Supremacy Clause, documented constitutional debates, the wording of the first amendment, actual U.S. Supreme Court case law, the need for the 14th amendment, and common sense.

Just .... let it slide.

367 posted on 03/09/2007 12:12:41 PM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: robertpaulsen

Given that the decision states, DC is not a state, where did "C) DC is a State", come from?


371 posted on 03/09/2007 12:15:38 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: robertpaulsen
Yes, I realize that's crazy, especially given the wording of the Preamble to the Bill of Rights, the actual purpose of the Supremacy Clause, documented constitutional debates, the wording of the first amendment, actual U.S. Supreme Court case law, the need for the 14th amendment, and common sense.

Funny... all those are on MY side of the argument. Not yours. All you've got is your dictum in your hands.

"It had become an universal and almost uncontroverted position in the several States, that the purposes of society do not require a surrender of all our rights to our ordinary governors; that there are certain portions of right not necessary to enable them to carry on an effective government, and which experience has nevertheless proved they will be constantly encroaching on, if submitted to them; that there are also certain fences which experience has proved peculiarly efficacious against wrong, and rarely obstructive of right, which yet the governing powers have ever shown a disposition to weaken and remove. Of the first kind, for instance, is freedom of religion; of the second, trial by jury, habeas corpus laws, free presses." --Thomas Jefferson to Noah Webster, 1790. ME 8:112

So yes. Bobby. The BoR protects individual Rights. Not just from the Feds, but from the States as well.

"What is true of every member of the society, individually, is true of them all collectively; since the rights of the whole can be no more than the sum of the rights of the individuals." --Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1789. ME 7:455, Papers 15:393

"Laws abridging the natural right of the citizen should be restrained by rigorous constructions within their narrowest limits." --Thomas Jefferson to Isaac McPherson, 1813. ME 13:327

"The whole of the Bill [of Rights] is a declaration of the right of the people at large or considered as individuals … It establishes some rights of the individual as unalienable and which consequently, no majority has a right to deprive them of." Albert Gallatin of the New York Historical Society, October 7, 1789

Page 46 of the decision in the thread in case you missed it:

To summarize, we conclude that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to keep and bear arms. That right existed prior to the formation of the new government under the Constitution and was premised on the private use of arms for activities such as hunting and self-defense, the latter being understood as resistance to either private lawlessness or the depredations of a tyrannical government (or a threat from abroad). In addition, the right to keep and bear arms had the important and salutary civic purpose of helping to preserve the citizen militia. The civic purpose was also a political expedient for the Federalists in the First Congress as it served, in part, to placate their Antifederalist opponents. The individual right facilitated militia service by ensuring that citizens would not be barred from keeping the arms they would need when called forth for militia duty. Despite the importance of the Second Amendment’s civic purpose, however, the activities it protects are not limited to militia service, nor is an individual’s enjoyment of the right contingent upon his or her continued or intermittent enrollment in the militia.

Go suck eggs you Brady Troll...

375 posted on 03/09/2007 12:19:12 PM PST by Dead Corpse (What would a free man do?)
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To: robertpaulsen

Thank you. Slide it shall.


376 posted on 03/09/2007 12:19:50 PM PST by KeyesPlease
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