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'That's Not Nice' - "Our political discourse needs more self-discipline" (re: Coulter & Maher)
Opinion Journal ^ | Friday March 9th, 2007 | Peggy Noonan

Posted on 03/09/2007 3:18:12 AM PST by ajolympian2004

Here is what has been said the past week or so that sparked argument: Bill Maher, on HBO, said a lot of lives would be saved if Vice President Cheney had died, and Ann Coulter, at a conservative political meeting, suggested John Edwards is a "faggot."

She was trying to be funny and get a laugh. He was trying to startle and get applause.

What followed was the predictable kabuki in which politically active groups and individuals feigned dismay as opposed to what many of them really felt, which was grim delight. Conservatives said they were chilled by Mr. Maher's comments, but I don't think they were. They were delighted he revealed what they believe is at the heart of modern liberalism, which is hate.

Liberals amused themselves making believe they were chilled by Ms. Coulter's remarks, but they were not. They were delighted she has revealed what they believe is at the heart of modern conservatism, which is hate.

The truth is many liberals were dismayed by Mr. Maher because he made them look bad, and many conservatives were mad at Ms. Coulter for the same reason.

I realized as I watched it all play out that there's a kind of simple way to know whether something you just heard is something that should not have been said. It is: Did it make you wince? When the Winceometer is triggered, it's an excellent indication that what you just heard is unfortunate and ought not to be repeated.

In both cases, Mr. Maher and Ms. Coulter, when I heard them, I winced. Did you? I thought so. In modern life we wince a lot. It's not the worst thing, but it's better when something makes you smile.

(Excerpt) Read more at opinionjournal.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: anncoulter; billmaher; coulter; cpac; cpac2007; dickcheney; hbo; johnedwards; maher; noonan; peggynoonan; realtime; rhymeswithmaggot
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To: Enduring Freedom

;-) I don't think that we agree. I don't worry about what anyone else is feeling because I am confident in my ideas and arguments. I undermine the arguments effectively by not burning bridges.

If your method works for you, so be it. It doesn't at the national level. Ask the conservative Dems who are still around about 1968.

Mark Twain once said that history doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes.


101 posted on 03/09/2007 5:22:29 AM PST by saveliberty (Liberalism (called Middle of the Road by MSM) = You are free to do as you are told.)
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To: saveliberty
You're wasting your time trying to reason with some people on this thread, IMO. There's nothing more to this story than the fact that Anne and Bill crave attention. Edwards should be criticized for many things that I enumerated in #70, but to INFER that a presidential candidate is a Faggot when he's not gay is ridiculous...There were so many other things Anne could have called him, mainly a LIBERAL...
102 posted on 03/09/2007 5:23:11 AM PST by Dr. Scarpetta
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To: twonie
The Abortion Party is making a big deal about the work fagot! What a joke!
103 posted on 03/09/2007 5:23:52 AM PST by angcat ("IF YOU DON'T STAND BEHIND OUR TROOPS, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO STAND IN FRONT OF THEM")
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To: Amos the Prophet

ann's comment reminds me of a true story

a player on our team was furious at the referee for a blown call

he approach the referee and said "will i be penalized if I think something bad about you?"

the ref replied "of course not - you can think anything you want - you just can't say it"

the player said "even if i think something like you're an a--hole?"

the ref, somewhat taken aback, said uncertainly "you can think whatever you please"

the player said "o.k., i think you're an a--hole" and walked away

the ref did not penalize him


104 posted on 03/09/2007 5:25:30 AM PST by Enduring Freedom (what does al qaeda and bush have in common? caves)
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To: ajolympian2004
American politics is hard knuckled blood sport. The Democrats understand this. You fight for the power and once you use it you use it to the hilt.

George Bush and his "new tone in Washington / turn the other cheek" pablem resulted in the Republicans losing Congress and Bush being in the toilet as far as support. Clinton is like a step-brother with mommie and poppy? Ted Kennedy and movies in the White house?

Unfortunately, Bush has used the same plan to protect his administration from leftists and media attacks as he has used to protect our borders.

Bush has shown poor judgement on so many things it's amazing. He's either a nice guy to the point of self-destruction or stupidly naive in that he thinks that the "other side" has the same decency he has.

105 posted on 03/09/2007 5:26:08 AM PST by isthisnickcool (Oh! The Obamanation! Durka durka durka...)
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To: isthisnickcool

the bush new tone shtick has decimated his base support and the respect of his cut-throat domestic socialist opposition

like the islamofascists, appeasement and compassion is seen as weakness by socialists

only the iron hand earns their respect, as the evidence from clinton to chavez to castro confirms


106 posted on 03/09/2007 5:29:52 AM PST by Enduring Freedom (what does al qaeda and bush have in common? caves)
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To: rpellegrini
I will put it this way, President Reagan fought liberals as well or better than anyone and did so with dignity and NO ONE under his authority would EVER have survived uttering a crude comment like Ann made. Liberals were afflicted with their malignancies, but President Reagan would not allow those within his authority stooping to liberals' lowest common denominator. He knew if Conservatives did, liberals had won.

Mistake. Yes. We all make them - so with no salvos hurled at Ann, I think she's smarter and can debate with more intellect than she demonstrated. Some say it was a joke. Maybe she was playing the "joke" on "Conservatives" fixing to embrace a cross-dressing pro-homosexual as "their" front-running candidate and had intended to imply Edwards embodies a better example of what they profess than their "chosen one".

Now, what was the rest of her "speech"?
107 posted on 03/09/2007 5:30:02 AM PST by azhenfud (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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To: Darkwolf377

Insulting presidents and candidates never reached the low point offered up by Whoopie Goldberg on stage in New York. The slimey wench reportedly grabbed at her crotch and was vulgar while making fun of our president. Edwards and Kerry were both there and laughed. It was a fundraiser with moveon.org. I believe and nobody came up with a video of it. Goldberg was disgusting. Coulter never came close to doing what the Democrats did that night in New York.


108 posted on 03/09/2007 5:34:54 AM PST by oldironsides
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To: oldironsides

once again, the point is that if there were reagan warriors on the gop team, the tactics of coulter wouldn't be relevant or necessary

no one is willing to put the rats on notice


109 posted on 03/09/2007 5:38:26 AM PST by Enduring Freedom (what does al qaeda and bush have in common? caves)
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To: Dr. Scarpetta

Oh I don't think that discussing different perspectives is bad. Some will agree and some won't - that's what conservatism defends. :-)


110 posted on 03/09/2007 5:45:31 AM PST by saveliberty (Liberalism (called Middle of the Road by MSM) = You are free to do as you are told.)
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To: hosepipe
Serious journalists are Engineering, Medical, or Legal dropouts..

With emphasis on the legal dropout, apparently. Seems like half the conservative talkshow hosts are ex-attorney's. Coutler's one as well, if memory serves.

111 posted on 03/09/2007 5:46:51 AM PST by Non-Sequitur (Save Fredericksburg. Support CVBT.)
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To: Don W
"I was going to say few words about Don W...but it seems when you use the word A$$HOLE in this forum, you will get suspended or worse....so I can't talk about Don W."

Now....did I say you were an A-hole?

Thanks for playing.

NOTE: Of course I don't think you are....wink...wink.

112 posted on 03/09/2007 5:49:39 AM PST by DCPatriot ("It aint what you don't know that kills you. It's what you know that aint so" Theodore Sturgeon))
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To: Enduring Freedom

LOL
If anything, our political discourse is hemmed in by sensitives, a linguistically challenged class of political barometers who flash red and hot at the use of any word that may offend their prissy sensitivities.


113 posted on 03/09/2007 5:57:52 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (here come I, gravitas in tow.)
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To: saveliberty

Then by all means mount a campaign to make her apologize then force her into rehab. Then she can be your perfect little republican robot.


114 posted on 03/09/2007 5:58:52 AM PST by abigailsmybaby
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To: rpellegrini

Ann Coulter who are willing to come out swinging and keep on fighting.



True, but can she please use facts and not advance the agenda of John's running for President....please. There was no evidence that what she said was factual. He of course has been through a death of a child so I am sure all this nonsense from her does not bother him one bit. He has been through hell and back with the unfortunate death of his 18 year old son. Anything else is mute!


115 posted on 03/09/2007 6:03:14 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: ajolympian2004

Is Ms. Noonan claiming that Ms. Coulter's and Mr. Maher's remarks are equivalent?

Great Ceasar's Ghost! Where's the wisdom? ...the discernment?

One said "I can't call him a poo-poo head because I'd be sent to rehab." and the other said "Somebody should kill him." And there is no difference???

Get a grip people!

jw


116 posted on 03/09/2007 6:08:03 AM PST by JWinNC (www.anailinhisplace.net)
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To: abigailsmybaby

;-) You miss the point.

Even if she's right on the issues, she can be her own worst enemy by selecting the wrong venue for that joke. And just because you like the point, doesn't mean that she delivered it perfectly.

Who cares about an apology? Fix the problem going forward - pick better opportunities and deliver them well.


117 posted on 03/09/2007 6:28:17 AM PST by saveliberty (Liberalism (called Middle of the Road by MSM) = You are free to do as you are told.)
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To: saveliberty

I haven't missed any point.

Ann should just renounce her personality and run everything by the FR Panel on Political Correctness before giving a speech anywhere.


118 posted on 03/09/2007 6:41:18 AM PST by abigailsmybaby
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To: L98Fiero
Ann graduated Cornell University and University of Michigan Law School (where she was law review editor) and, likely, some high school before that.

Didn't you graduate high school? Are you jealous of her?

The "turbomannered wimps are the faux conservatives who are too busy attacking our own to attack the enemies of our civilization, our country and our movement and attack, not on issues but on their pecksniff view of proper manners.

Does Edwards have a faggot foreign policy? Does he have a faggot military policy? Does he have a faggot criminal enforcement policy? Does Edwards not seek the nomination of the faggot party???? Etc. If so, what's your problem? If not, explain his manliness to conservatives.

Conservatism and libertarianism have diverged since Barry Goldwater resisted Ronald Reagan every inch of the way. Is it "self-annointed" to refuse to ally with those who want to comfort the sexually perverted and those who would see innocent babies killed? Goldwater did both as he freely admitted.

Is it "classy" or "dignified" to kill babies or to abuse the nether end of the digestive tract of oneself or another? It may offend those in either category or both to have the truth tail pinned to their particular donkey. Those who are dressed up in their "offended outrage" costumes are really offended by the public use of the term "faggot" and not that it was inferentially used as to Edwards who is politically indistinguishable from the genuine article. Yo are never going to be part of a conservative movement that limits itself to scholarly discussions of Adam Smith much less of Ayn Rand, complete with exaggerated and absolutely undue respect for the practitioners of the despicable.

As to "self-annointed," I served as a state chairman of YAF, YRs, CRs, Ronald Reagan's challenge to Ford in 1976, as a member of the National Executive Committees of YRs and CRs, none of which posts were "self-annointed." I was also a pro bono (free) lawyer for over 1100 pro-lifers criminally arrested for taking direct action on behalf of the unborn. 30 of the 1100 were criminally convicted or convicted of non-criminal infractions (equivalent of parking tickets). The rest were found not guilty or dismissed. Speaking of "self-annointed", what are YOUR credentials?

Also, please explain the "conservative" way of slaughtering 50+ million unborn babies or of engaging in the abuse of the nether end of the digestive tract, in a "classy" and dignified manner, of course. You DO want to persuader us to be more respectful of the despicable and even to the point of becoming a more "diverse" movement, right? How will we ever survive without the Mark Foleys????

In any event, I absolve you of any claim that you may be part of any political movement in which I have labored. I know better and so do you.

119 posted on 03/09/2007 6:41:41 AM PST by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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To: ajolympian2004

There's never been anything "nice" about politics and ever since Hillary introduced Saul Alinsky's tactics into the game, it's gotten worse.


120 posted on 03/09/2007 6:48:07 AM PST by Beckwith (The dhimmicrats and liberal media have chosen sides and they've sided with the Jihadists.)
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