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What really happened in border shooting? [Ramos-Compean, Border Patrol Agents]
AP ^ | 2-16-2007 | PAULINE ARRILLAGA,

Posted on 02/19/2007 8:13:58 PM PST by deport

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1 quits, 2 other border agents fight for jobs after testifying in Ramos-Compean case

El Paso Times article which can't be posted...... Other agents are being terminated it seems.

1 posted on 02/19/2007 8:14:02 PM PST by deport
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To: calcowgirl

ping


2 posted on 02/19/2007 8:18:50 PM PST by SoCalPol (Duncan Hunter '08 Tough on WOT & Illegals)
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To: deport
"...We're not going to throw away the United States Constitution," lead prosecutor Kanof said in her closing argument. "We're not going to wad it up and put it in the trash can because Osvaldo was transporting marijuana that day."

HURL!!

Get your copy of the Constitution and keep it in your safe. After the coming ugliness, maybe there'll be enough copies left to rebuild America from the ashes.

3 posted on 02/19/2007 8:26:53 PM PST by HKMk23 (Total domination over all kingdoms under heaven will be given to the saints of YHVH. -- Daniel 7:27)
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To: deport
Tripping down through the article, when you get to about the 47th clause you find a reference to ".... the report .....".

The AP writer tells you what a certain "written report" says ~ yet, in the preceding 46 clauses the AP writer has been telling you what the border agents did or did not "report" to their supervisors.

I think what we have here is another one of those "when you say it in Spanish it's clear" deals, just like we had in California when the Hispanic caucus went after the Vietnamese candidate and lied about what a letter sent out of his office to new voters really said.

I am sure the AP reporter didn't realize that the use of "report" as an active verb, and "the report" as a noun, are pretty clearly different things in their context in English.

Still, the AP editor did his best to translate this mess into useful English ~ which is what reveals it to be mostly propaganda.

4 posted on 02/19/2007 8:27:21 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: deport
"...turned and saw Compean firing his Beretta handgun. He said he saw Compean reload, fire a few more shots and then dash into the vega.

That means he must have fired at least 12 rounds, maybe 17. Something doesn't sound right about that.

5 posted on 02/19/2007 8:33:21 PM PST by VanShuyten ("By the simple exercise of our will, we can exert a power for good practically unbounded, etc, etc.")
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To: VanShuyten

Not if it was a .45. Anyone know what caliber gun he used?


6 posted on 02/19/2007 8:38:03 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: VanShuyten

That means he must have fired at least 12 rounds, maybe 17. Something doesn't sound right about that.



In what way?....... I think most things I've read allude to Compean firing fourteen rounds and Ramos one....


7 posted on 02/19/2007 8:38:41 PM PST by deport ( Cue Spooky Music...)
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To: muawiyah

I beleive they are referring to the drug seizure report, not a shooting report.


8 posted on 02/19/2007 8:39:36 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: Bob J
You can believe what you want. I'm simply pointing to a propaganda trick the AP reporter used.

The deal is you talk about one thing with a name similar to that of something else you are going to trot out later for a totally different purpose.

We're not going to resolve the issue of the two border agents in these threads but we can sure dig up and highlight AP's treachery.

9 posted on 02/19/2007 8:43:14 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

I'm not sure I understand your point. Where is the propaganda?


10 posted on 02/19/2007 8:49:04 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: Bob J
The writer has construed two different stories as constituting a single item.

She has the agents NOT REPORTING, and then she has a REPORT prepared by a supervisor that doesn't reflect what she wants us to believe wasn't reported.

That is propaganda.

After all the requirement for the agents to do an "oral report" is a totally different process than that which results in a "written report" by a supervisor, and they take place at different times and as a consequence of different rules.

11 posted on 02/19/2007 8:58:20 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah
The only two reports I see mentiond are the drug seizure report and a report to "investigators". That report was by request of the shooting incident investigators after the shiite hit the fan.
12 posted on 02/19/2007 9:31:51 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: muawiyah
What do you make of these statements? Do you think the guy is lying, maybe an illegal sympathizer?

"Retired Border Patrol agent David Ham, a former assistant chief in El Paso, trekked out to the shooting scene not long ago. He wanted to see it for himself as the national outrage grew." "They're picking the wrong guys to make heroes," he said." "After 31 years in the Border Patrol, Ham heads up the retired agents' association in El Paso. Months back, a Border Patrol official gave the group an overview of the case against Ramos and Compean; Ham and some other retired colleagues have since refused to appear at vigils or news conferences in defense of the men. "

13 posted on 02/19/2007 9:37:40 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: deport

Propaganda: information that is spread for the purpose of promoting some cause.

As usual the Associated Press writes another tilted story, a hit-piece almost, to make the agents look bad. It quotes one juror whose happy to see these two agents in jail, but fails to note the one who thinks they're innoncent now and was tricked into voting guilty. Though at least they mentioned two who think they're innocent on some counts they were convicted of. Most of the quotes are anti-agent too. A sad attempt to debunk anything. It doesn't even mentioned the lying before congress or the 81 representatives who support a pardon.

The Associated Press, slowly but surely, becomes a bigger laughing stock at time goes on.


14 posted on 02/19/2007 9:39:58 PM PST by NapkinUser (Free Ramos and Compean! Disbarment for the Nifong-wannabe Johnny Sutton.)
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To: Bob J
Not if it was a .45. Anyone know what caliber gun he used?

I think I read in the transcript that it was a .40 and that there was a magazine exchange. The reporter's version does not quite jibe with all that I had read in the transcripts either. Definitely propaganda.

15 posted on 02/19/2007 9:45:12 PM PST by Colorado Doug
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To: NapkinUser

"The Associated Press, slowly but surely, becomes a bigger laughing stock at time goes on."

That should read: The Associated Press, slowly but surely, becomes a bigger laughing stock as time goes on.

The AP makes it sound like just a few representatives want a pardon. 81 is a lot.


16 posted on 02/19/2007 9:48:02 PM PST by NapkinUser (Free Ramos and Compean! Disbarment for the Nifong-wannabe Johnny Sutton.)
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To: deport
One thing that I've never heard any of these guys' defenders answer: Why were the shell casings tossed into the ditch? That's part of a crime scene and no police officer I've ever known would be that careless.
17 posted on 02/19/2007 9:48:25 PM PST by WestVirginiaRebel (A liberal is a man too broadminded to take his own side in a quarrel-Robert Frost)
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To: Colorado Doug

"The reporter's version does not quite jibe with all that I had read in the transcripts either."

How so?


18 posted on 02/19/2007 9:48:36 PM PST by Bob J (RIGHTALK.com...a conservative alternative to NPR!)
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To: deport
Compean did tell at least two other agents that he fired at the driver. One was Art Vasquez, who testified that Compean asked him to look for additional shell casings. Vasquez testified that he found five and tossed them into the murky ditch, then called Compean to tell him he'd thrown them away.

Vasquez didn't testify, unless the court somehow wiped all mention of his testimony from the trial transcripts that Johnny Sutton released.

19 posted on 02/19/2007 9:56:12 PM PST by calcowgirl ("Liberalism is just Communism sold by the drink." P. J. O'Rourke)
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To: deport
If Aldrete had actually been armed, one of the prosecutors asked him, "You were a sitting duck up there, weren't you?" "Yes, sir," Yrigoyen testified.

And what did he say on Cross Examination? The threat was over by the time this guy arrived. "It was over by the time I got there." He wasn't a sitting duck; Aldrete-Davila was already on the other side of the Rio Grande in Mexico when this guy drove up on the scene!.

This article is filled with the same kind of rhetoric Johnny Sutton has been putting out for the last year.

20 posted on 02/19/2007 10:02:55 PM PST by calcowgirl ("Liberalism is just Communism sold by the drink." P. J. O'Rourke)
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