California's future may be paved with fees (Are Toll Roads The Future?)

LA Times ^ | 13 February 2007 | Evan Halper

[shrinkermd]

Toll Roads will surely cut down traffic, reduce taxes and permit more and better freeways.

[GeorgefromGeorgia]

In some ways, toll roads are a solution without raising taxes or imposing on people. However, I lived in Europe for several years, and drove all over Europe. Germany is one of the few countries that doesn't have toll roads. Other countries like Italy have very expensive tolls. Italy subsidizes rail travel, and you can generally take second class rail for two or even three persons cheaper than buying gas and paying tolls for an auto. It does keep the autostratas more wide open for traffic, but the cost is significant. The NJ turnpike is expensive, but Italian tolls are MORE. Imagine paying $200-$300 to drive from Atlanta to NYC.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Is that why a freeway is called freeway? Makes sense if that's the case.

[Who dat?]

California, birthplace of the freeway,

I was always under the impression that the Pennsylvania Turnpike was the first “freeway” in the US and, I believe, it isn’t in California.

[Izzy Dunne]

Toll Roads will surely cut down traffic, reduce taxes and permit more and better freeways.

You must be joking.

Do you really think they will REDUCE the gas tax if the toll roads go thru?

I don't.

As for cutting down traffic, I invite you to travel the Mass Pike sometime.

[LIConFem]

"I owe my soul to the company government store..."

[PGalt]

If you drive a car, I'll tax the street
If you try to sit, I'll tax your seat
If you get too cold, I'll tax the heat
If you take a walk, I'll tax your feet
Taxman - Beatles

[org.whodat]

Toll Roads will surely cut down traffic, reduce taxes and permit more and better freeways.

It's always a pleasure to find someone to sell some bridge stock to. How many share do you wish to buy, I can get you in on the ground floor at the moment.

[DB]

People don't choose to be in a traffic jam anymore than they can choose not to go to work.

There is already plenty of incentive to avoid peak hours if it were a choice. You don't have to add insult to injury by forcing them to pay a toll on top of it all...

And I for don't believe all the money already collected on gas and other road related road fees goes towards roads. I think a large percentage of it finds its way to the politicians other pet projects.

[jim_trent]

> You must be joking.

Do you really think that the gas taxes (which are less now than 30 years ago when adjusted for inflation) pay for all the new road construction that constituents demand AND the maintenance of those roads?

If you said "yes", you are wrong.

And what makes it worse is that the California legislature has raised to a fine art the ways to raid the gas tax fund for things that have NOTHING to do with roads.

[org.whodat]

I was always under the impression that the Pennsylvania TurnpikePothole was the first “freeway” in the US and, I believe, it isn’t in California.

There now that is the truth.

[Domicile of Doom]

What about all the Illegal Aliens that will just drive on through the EZ tag lane and never pay?

[Izzy Dunne]

Do you really think that the gas taxes (which are less now than 30 years ago when adjusted for inflation) pay for all the new road construction that constituents demand AND the maintenance of those roads?

No, but that's what they're sold on. And I simply don't believe that the greenies in CA will allow a REDUCTION in the gas tax, because that would ENCOURAGE gas consumption (at least in their eyes).

[A Strict Constructionist]

I see it as a new way to support Mexican Health Care. They will probably get free passes.

[OregonRancher]

I was always under the impression that the Pennsylvania Turnpike was the first “freeway” in the US and, I believe, it isn’t in California.


Arroyo Seco Freeway (Pasadena) opened December 20, 1940.
No tolls

[ClaireSolt]

I cut my teeth on the CA freeways, but when I visited Socal in 95, they were decrepit.

[Carry_Okie]

Private toll roads subsidized by eminent domain are a constitutional travesty.

[OregonRancher]

"I cut my teeth on the CA freeways, but when I visited Socal in 95, they were decrepit."

I remember going to LA on the Pasadena freeway with my Dad in his '49 Chrysler sedan as a kid...you're right, the freeways are turning into junk and they're just as bad in Northern Cal.

Thank god I moved to Oregon decades ago.

[ridesthemiles]

This is the legacy of Gray Davis raiding the roads funds not once or twice, but 3 times. All your taxes paid by the gallon in Kalifornia were taken out of the correct fund and put into the "General Fund" and spent willy-nilly. Entire Kalifornia Legislature can take a healthy share of the blame, also. They didn't raise a ruckus, and they spent the money.

[jim_trent]

I agree that is what they are sold on. However, I don't know how to break this to you gently. Politicians lie.

If the gas tax kept pace with construction inflation and if the legislature in California did not raid the fund for "gay parks", museums, and other non-transporation spending, the roads there would be in much, MUCH better shape.