Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: R. Scott; A_perfect_lady
Back in my youth I read The Conscience of a Conservative by Barry Goldwater. (Actually ghost-written in 1960 by the grandfather of L. Brent Bozell.) Goldwater criticized the mania at that time on the part of the US Foreign Policy Community and the UN for ending colonial rule in Africa and elsewhere. He was especially caustic on the idea that democracy was exportable and that everybody was ready for it. Due to cultural differences, he felt that exporting democracy was a fool's errand. Only those cultures that had sufficient experience with English Common Law, either by culture or by conquest, could handle self-rule. There were simply some societies that were not ready for self-government. Sometimes the best that could be expected was a benevolent despot, preferably one that sided with us rather than the Soviets.

A "nation" of Sunni Kurds, Sunni Arabs and Shia Arabs -- all itching to dominate and even kill each other -- cannot function as a stable platform for democracy. The Arabs are Semitic, and the Kurds are Celtic, like the Irish and Welsh. The Kurds view the Arabs as a lower form of life, somewhere between worms and lizards, and would prefer not to share a country with them. Sunni and Shia Arabs have been persecuting each other for 14 centuries and their attitude is, "Why mess with success?"

One question that our soldiers began asking was, "Is Iraq the way it is because of Saddam, or was Saddam the way he was because of Iraq?" At first we thought it was the former, but now it appears to be the latter.

This ties in to something I call the "Trash Can Theory of History". (Maybe I should copyright it.) There are some countries that can only function when a trash can lid is firmly put in place. Remove that lid and all kinds of horrible things slither out.

Occasionally, a trash can lid works a miracle, and the people are ready for self-rule. Spain under Franco is a good example. When the Spanish Civil War ended with a German intervention, half the people of Spain were quite willing to torture and kill the other half. Franco's 36 years of military dictatorship gave the Spanish a cooling-off period for the war generation to die or just get old. Franco was an adept practitioner of Freesmith's Equation (Fear + Hate = Power), and the Spanish hated and feared Franco more than they hated and feared each other. Thus, Franco offered a generation of stability. Once he was gone, the people were ready to rule themselves, and aside from a single hiccup early in King Juan Carlos' rule, they've done quite well.

Iraq and Yugoslavia are textbook examples of trash can lids being removed too soon. Regrettably, I'm coming to believe that only a strongman can hold Iraq together, preferably someone less psychotic than Saddam.

96 posted on 02/04/2007 12:16:53 PM PST by Publius (A = A)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 88 | View Replies ]


To: Publius
I'm coming to believe that only a strongman can hold Iraq together,

That's what I told people during the Gulf War when I was in Europe! Few months ago, I said what you essentially said above. I suggested to get the worst bunch of Iraqi generals from our custody, give each $10 mil in a Swiss Bank account and tell them what you want.

Look the other way, declare Iraq an exclusion zone for the press and foreigners and let the new sheriffs deal with it. You may be quite surprised for the quick transformation to a Turkish type democracy, the only democracy in the Islamic world.

You can call me crazy if you wish, but this is almost the only way plus of course cutting the snake’s head, pulverizing Iran, that is.

105 posted on 02/04/2007 12:56:22 PM PST by melancholy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies ]

To: Publius

the history channel traced Saddam's father back to Hitler
Was Hitler the way he was because of Germany?
That's a cop out


113 posted on 02/04/2007 1:19:34 PM PST by Convert (Praying for a swift, honorable,merciful,charitable victory with peace founded on God's Mercy and Law)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies ]

To: Publius
Regrettably, I'm coming to believe that only a strongman can hold Iraq together, preferably someone less psychotic than Saddam.

You may be right, but I don't know if we are or ever were in the position to place the required "benevolent strongman" into position. It just isn't one of our options.

154 posted on 02/04/2007 7:53:05 PM PST by A_perfect_lady
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies ]

To: Publius
Iraq and Yugoslavia are textbook examples of trash can lids being removed too soon. Regrettably, I'm coming to believe that only a strongman can hold Iraq together, preferably someone less psychotic than Saddam.

The real commonality between Iraq and Yugoslavia is that both are thrown together countries, that are not really "nations". Yugoslavia and Iraq were both created out of fragments of the losers of WW-I, the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Ottoman Empire respectively. This was much less true of Spain, which while it does have regions which were once independent countries/Kingdoms, is a much more homogeneous society, and the union of those nations was some 400+ years in the past at the time of the Spanish Civil War. Even the American colonies had a common language and common history. The American Civil War and the Spanish Civil War had much in common, in that the differences were more cultural/ideological than ethnic or religious per se. It didn't take a dictator to reunite the American people. It took time, and an external enemy, ironically enough, the dying Spanish Empire.

173 posted on 02/04/2007 11:26:49 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies ]

To: Publius
I'm coming to believe that only a strongman can hold Iraq together, preferably someone less psychotic than Saddam.

I guess neither of us are being very PC - but there are times the truth isn’t PC.

179 posted on 02/05/2007 2:38:51 AM PST by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson