Germany issues CIA arrest orders

bbc.com ^

[expatguy]

I give you the chance to reconsider the tone of your post. As a German citizen I certainly feel offended by your post.

You can feel offended all you want.

The poster and many others here (including myself) are equally (if not more) offended at your country's behaviour.

So, let me say something that you would be advised to take to heart.

Lay one hand on one of our agents and your country will suffer the consequences.

[UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide]

The names of the 13 agents will never be released so this won´t have any consequences at all...

Don't count on it.



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[expatguy]

LOL

[Michael81Dus]

Oh - and WE don´t have the right to say the same for our INNOCENT citizens?

[Michael81Dus]

The law to keep arrested only until the end of the day following the arrest or get an arrest warrant by court, for instance. Of course, your agents had no authority for their actions in Macedonia - I call that kidnapping.

[Michael81Dus]

Alas, I can hardly find a disagreement between us.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Of course, your agents had no authority for their actions in Macedonia...

How do you know officials in Macedonia weren't complicit? The German government has no jurisdiction.

Of course we are at war, so what anyone else has to say about it is of little consequence. They can take a number...

[Michael81Dus]

See post http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1776659/posts?page=87#22 We HAVE jurisdiction.

[americanbychoice3]

Michael, wouldn't it be prudent to include arrest warrants for Europeans as well as BND officials who knew about this and were compliant? I won't hold my breath

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

To those Germans who don't fit in the above categories, you need to speak up and make your voices heard. If you want to sit on the sidelines in this war, then get out of our way. Issuing indictments against American personnel who are risking life and limb in this war is an outrageously provocative act. Especially coming from a supposed ally.

Here, here... Germany has a lot to account for before Germans start criticizing the USA. It was the German government who sold chemical warfare devices and materials to Saddam Hussein.

So, some Islamic suspect who was misidentified and taken someplace where they put panties on his head is hardly a comparison.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Germany has a lot to account for before Germans start criticizing the USA. It was the German government who sold chemical warfare devices and materials to Saddam Hussein.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

It was the German government who sold chemical warfare devices and materials to Saddam Hussein.

So, some Islamic suspect who was misidentified and taken someplace where they put panties on his head is hardly a comparison.

I would readily admit the CIA is somewhat a rogues' gallery. I don't expect them to be nice guys. This is not Roger Moore in a James Bond movie or an Austin Powers spy parody.

The German government can kiss my a$$...

[americanbychoice3]

I am not going to say that the CIA is totally innocent on this one. No matter how you plan thing out even with the best intentions and expetise, mistakes can happen.
What I dislike is that only Americans are apparently being made the villains.
This is extremely comp[lex, many Government agencies involved around the globe. To focus on America only fits well into the Anti-American sntiments being fostered especially in Germany.
Personally I am getting somewhat furious at being portrayed by our supposed "friends' as the scum of the earth. I am more and more becoming an isolationist, especially when it comes to military intervention and protection of foreign countries. Let us use our resources to protect our own country, encourage Europe to take care of their own and advise the world that we resign from being their pokice persons. Let's be likeSwitzerland, economically strong and neutral on everything else. We only get stabbed in the back anyway.
Here is something interesting about this situation. Pay attention to the date.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/03/AR2005120301476_pf.html

[Michael81Dus]

No. As in the US, it is not required to report crimes to the police, except for few severe crimes (for instance murder). So, knowing about a crime and doing nothing is not illegal.

[Michael81Dus]

Ok, show me the proof! You raised a claim, I want you to prove it. You cannot. The "German government" never sold chemicals to anybody. If ever, it was German companies - before 1991 with the approval of the government (just like lots of American companies - may I remind you of the handshake Hussein/Rumsfeld?), and after it, illegally without the knowledge of the government. Claiming otherwise requires you to provide evidence.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

I don't need to show you proof, you readily admit the German government has allowed the sale and shipment of chemical warfare materials to Saddam Hussein.

The United States has never allowed this.

The UK and USA sold very little to Saddam, most of it was in the form of transport vehicles and helicopters. The United States did not arm Saddam, the French, Russians and Chinese provided Saddam Hussein with the vast majority of military hardware...

Nor did the United States put Saddam in power, the Soviets did...

[americanbychoice3]

If there is a crime it is called complicity. (Beihilfe)
Of course there is no country that doesn't have clean hands when it comes to international intelligence.
Did you read my link?

[Michael81Dus]

...you readily admit the German government has allowed the sale and shipment of chemical warfare materials to Saddam Hussein.

Excuse me, but: are you dumb? Where did I post that? "Allowing" requires an act of will, while "not knowing" certainly implies no will at all.

Therefore, prove your claims or STFU!

Link 1

Link 2

[dennisw]

Right on but that was Eastwood

[Michael81Dus]

You posted no link to me. Beihilfe bedarf 1. einer Unterstützungshandlung (das kann auch moralische Unterstützung sein) und 2. eines Vorsatzes bezüglich der vorsätzlich rechtswidrigen Haupttat eines anderen. D.h. wenn A den D entführt, und B das als Zeuge sieht, aber NICHTS macht, dann ist nur A strafbar, denn eine Anzeigepflicht für Freiheitsberaubung besteht nicht (s. § 138 StGB). Wir sind ein freies Land, HandlungsPFLICHTEN gibt es nur selten. Im übrigens besteht die Anzeigepflicht in den Fällen nach § 138 StGB nur, sofern noch Zeit ist, die Ausführung der Tat zu verhindern. Im hier betreffenden Fall war das Opfer bereits verschleppt worden.