Posted on 01/23/2007 8:54:27 AM PST by thackney
Big hurdles include the cost: millions per car
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WASHINGTON - Ford Motor Co. is joining the list of automakers working on a plug-in hybrid — with a twist. It combines the convenience of plugging in your car with a zero-emissions hydrogen fuel cell.
Ford today is to display what it calls the world's first drivable fuel cell hybrid electric vehicle with plug-in capability. Called the Flexible Series Hybrid Edge, it represents the latest offering from automakers hoping to stake a claim to the next generation of highly efficient alternative automobiles.
Gerhard Schmidt, Ford's vice president of research and advanced engineering, said the vehicle, based on the Ford Edge crossover platform, gives the company "the ultimate in flexibility in researching advanced propulsion technology."
"We could take the fuel cell power system out and replace it with a downsized diesel, gasoline engine or any other powertrain connected to a small electric generator to make electricity like the fuel cell does now," Schmidt said.
Ford was showing the plug-in fuel cell at the Washington Auto Show, where lawmakers and government officials were viewing a number of advanced vehicle technologies. The show opens for media previews on the eve of President Bush's State of the Union address, which is expected to include energy proposals of concern to the auto industry.
Several automakers have been working on similar technologies. General Motors Corp. will display the Chevrolet Volt, a plug-in electric car recently unfurled in Detroit with a range of 40 miles on the battery and more than 600 miles with a gas engine.
DaimlerChrysler has been pursuing plug-in hybrids and said Friday it would expand its test fleet in the U.S. to more than 20 Dodge Sprinter vans. The company's chairman, Dieter Zetsche, and Chrysler Group Chief Executive Tom LaSorda were expected to discuss clean diesel technology at the auto show on Tuesday.
Volkswagen will be showing the Golf GT TSI for the first time in the United States. The vehicle's supercharged gasoline engine has 170 horsepower while garnering 40 miles per gallon in the city and 48 mpg on the highway. VW estimates the vehicle gets 638 miles on one tank of fuel.
Ford's plug-in hybrid Edge operates in battery only mode for the first 25 miles, moving at speeds of up to 85 miles per hour. When the battery is depleted to 40 percent, it shifts to the fuel-cell mode, which recharges the battery for 200 more miles of range.
The 336-volt lithium ion battery pack can be fully charged overnight — in about eight hours — with either a 110 or 220 volt outlet, and the engine produces gas mileage of about 41 miles per gallon. Drivers who travel fewer than 50 miles per day would get more than 80 miles per gallon, Ford said.
The combined plug-in-hydrogen vehicle offers a new way to address some of the challenges of hydrogen fuel cells. The pollution-free technology could provide a sustainable energy source through the mixture of hydrogen and oxygen, but it faces a number of hurdles with its size, weight, cost and lack of a fueling infrastructure.
Ford reduced the fuel cell's size, weight and cost by half and said its approach would double the lifespan of the fuel cell's stack.
Mujeeb Ijaz, Ford's manager for fuel cell vehicle engineering, said the changes were "a great step to commercializing" the vehicle.
Ford has not set a date when it would be available.
The automaker said the vehicles cost millions of dollars each and commercialization remains hindered by a lack of a hydrogen infrastructure and the cost of lithium-ion batteries.
I think you ought to learn a little more science.
They don't say if that is the prototype or expected production cost.
A standard prototype often costs car companies over $1 million each for your everyday gas-powered car.
The first car co to come up with a H/batt no gas vehicle and sell it for under 35k will be the winner. The dems including GW will be passing laws in the very near future making gas about $5/GAL. They are going to tax us into oblivion in the next 12 to 18 months.
The H/batt car will be the future. No one will want to wait in long lines even for the Hybrid.
Where is the hydrogen going to come from?
Series.
As in Series Hybrids vs. Parallel. The "Volt" is a Series Hybrid.
So the Million Dollar question is did they change this Prototype Escape from Parallel to Series.
If my assumptions are correct and they have added a plug in capacity as well as swapped out for Lithium Ion Batteries, this would be a clone drive-train to the "Volt".
Does anyone see the pattern here and the significance of it?
Sounds series to me.
And one more thing... The Fuel Cell is as James Carville would say boob bait for bubbas... Any engine would work to run the generator.
you can believe false articles if you wish but if you do a little research of the news reports in Canada in 1936 you will see that Mr. Pogues invention did get 205 mpg's. He was bought out for millions of dollars as other inventors have been. Why do the big oil companies own something like 98 high mileage patents?...look it up, that's a fact too. Did you know that if all of the energy in one gallon of gas were exploded underneath the empire state building it would lift it up one inch. I have done so much research on the subject, there just is no question about it. A huge gain in everyone's mpg's would greatly reduce the oil companies profits and they are financially intertwined with the car makers. Not to mention the big cut in gas tax revenues. I hope you really look into the facts rather than just believe it's a fantasy based on limited research and some kind of odd preconcieved notion.
forgot an interesting link...http://www.electrifyingtimes.com/gasolinevapor.html
I think you need to double up on your tinfoil hat.
Even Mr Pogue later denied the claims. I have more than a little research in the subject and I am quite aware of the energy contained in gasoline.
Oh, now you've gone and done it. Don't you realize you've put your life in jeopardy, as well as those of every single person who has read this thread, by letting the secret of the 100 mpg (or was it 200?) carburetor out of the bag? Big Oil and their co-conspirators aren't going to stand for this sort of thing, you know. I'm leaving the office now to go into hiding, and I think you'd better, too.
You should look at the newspaper reports of Mr. Pogues test drive and the fact that he was bought out. They are not made up. Of course there are going to be false stories that it never happened. Anyone can write anything. By the way, Mr. Pogue may have had to say that it never happened. What you are doing is under estimating the length that oil companies will go to to not drastically cut their profits. There is so much truth out there about high mileage devices that to deny it is pretty weird. I don't know why you are doing it? Maybe you have bought a lie and just haven't wanted to admitt it? Sorry, but a ton of evidence is on my side as well as the 100% gain in mpg's that I obtained with a much simpler device in my plymouth fury. I didn't fantasize that either.
You at least got one thing right.
Have a nice day.
By this time any patent on this invention would have expired. If the idea is so great why hasn't the idea been used by anyone anywhere in the world?
A fool and his money are soon parted.
--Sorry, but a ton of evidence is on my side as well as the 100% gain in mpg's that I obtained with a much simpler device in my plymouth fury. I didn't fantasize that either.--
Why don't you start a company and put out a lot of info-mercials on late night TV. You could get rich, you know!
--and some kind of odd preconcieved notion.--
Like the laws of thermo-dynamics?
I have read about this in on-line articles over the past two years. The general agreement is that quantities of millions of cars would lower all production costs to be several thousand more than what we currently pay for our gasoline powered cars.
Keep in mind that advances in fuel cells are coming yearly. That what a company would make today is a generation behind what it would make next year and two generations behind what the company would make in two years. I believe that with current advances, in five years, fuel cell production will be quantum leaps over how a fuel cell would be made today. Look at the advances in gasoline powered cars over the last century.
The infrastructure is bought up repeatedly, but I think it is not relevant. If the following two hurdles can be overcome, (1) an efficient fuel cell manufactured cheaply and (2) hydrogen produced more efficiently (two big ifs), the infrastructure will pop into being overnight because of capitalism.
I'm intrigued by your knowlege of the Big Oil Conspiracies, perpetual motion machines, and UFO technologies. Where can I subscribe to your newsletter?
We need advances in hydrogen production.
Advances that may or may not come. A lot of research is going into that very question. I give it better than a fifty fifty chance.
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