As a young pastor, I was one of the first who argued the very points that the NYTimes makes in this article.
However, I think I was also one of the first to see how wrong they were as well.
That means I can tie both sides up on knots, and I'm not above doing so.
Basically, the NYTimes et al make the following argument: "If feels good, I like it, I was born this way, so God must think it's okay too." Unfortunately, after 20+ years of genetic searches, there is no evidence that people are "born this way." Even if they are "born this way," many other practices (ie, alcohol abuse) are outside of the blessing of Christianity, and therefore does not change the conversation.
What gays and lesbians need to argue is that their activities need to moved from the "sin" list to the "blessed" list. To do that, they must compare their activities to things that everyone agrees must stay on the "sin" list (ie, pedophilia), and tell us why their situation is different. However, the minute you get into this conversation with them, most gays and lesbians blow up and leave the room -- they cannot, or will not, have this conversation!!!
The homosexual movement is a cult, just like Jonestown. BTW, Jim Jones was a radical Leftist.
What gays and lesbians need to argue is that their activities need to moved from the "sin" list to the "blessed" list. To do that, they must compare their activities to things that everyone agrees must stay on the "sin" list (ie, pedophilia), and tell us why their situation is different. However, the minute you get into this conversation with them, most gays and lesbians blow up and leave the room -- they cannot, or will not, have this conversation!!!
>>It's because you've won the argument. They know they're wrong and that their passions are disordered, and that's why they act the way they do. They belong to a denial cult.
BTW, Jim Jones was gay.
The Bible and homosexuality
"Main article: The Bible and homosexuality The Bible is regarded by most Christians as inspired by God or at least recording God's relationship with humanity and includes within it certain moral teachings. Passages from the Bible commonly used in the debate over homosexuality include Leviticus 18 and 21, Romans 1, 1 Timothy 1:10, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 and Jude 7. The arguments over these passages have centered on the extent to which these passages are still relevant; whether they refer only to certain sexual acts or to homosexual orientation; and how they should be interpreted, understood and applied...
...Many Church Fathers condemned homosexuality [1]. In his fourth homily on Romans [2], St. John Chrysostom argued in the fourth century that homosexual intercourse is worse than murder and so degrading that it constitutes a kind of punishment in itself, and that their enjoyment actually makes it worse, "for suppose I were to see a person running naked, with his body all besmeared with mire, and yet not covering himself, but exulting in it, I should not rejoice with him, but should rather bewail that he did not even perceive that he was doing shamefully." He also said:
But nothing can there be more worthless than a man who has pandered himself. For not the soul only, but the body also of one who hath been so treated, is disgraced, and deserves to be driven out everywhere.
The Council of Ancyra (314) prescribed a penance of at least twenty years' duration for those guilty of "bestial lust" [3]. There is dispute whether this reference is to homosexuality or bestiality, but it was received in the West as governing penances for sodomy...
An earlier Doctor of the Church, St. Peter Damian, wrote the Liber Gomorrhianus, an extended attack on both homosexuality and masturbation [12]. He portrayed homosexuality as a counter-rational force undermining morality, religion, and society itself [13], and in need of strong suppression lest it spread even and especially among clergy [14]....
The point is many in the clergy have had very different views and remedies on the basis of Scripture. It also seems the approach to homosexual acts has evolved over time as well. It is not an easy subject to discuss but the section on homosexuality and Greece as well as Rome gives even a different perspective.
Jesus said some things only come out by prayer AND fasting. Sexual sin is a very powerful sin. The Bible tells how Joseph, when Potipher's wife tried to seduce him, he RAN AWAY! That is the attitude we need to have with sexual sin, or with any sin, for that matter. How serious, really, are we?? What really are the desires of our hearts?? What really are our secret thoughts?? If we really want to see this nation changed, we can no longer rely on half hearted prayers, half hearted commitment. If you stop feeding something long enough, it will die. In what way are you really praying? Are you always pleading with God?? Maybe you need to begin speaking to the mountain yourself! Speak to it again, and again and again. When the Israelites spied out the land, and returned, when most said "there are Giants in the land ", though they were speaking facts, God considered it an evil report! Joshua had a different Spirit! He knew that God had given them the land! That is the spirit we need! That is the attitude we need! "It is written, therefore I believe, and I will not be moved!"