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The amnesty fallacy
Neshoba Democrat ^ | November 22, 2006 | RICH LOWRY

Posted on 11/26/2006 8:27:15 PM PST by neverdem

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To: oldbill
But he won't and he will take the Republicans down a suicidal path with his "comprehensive immigration reform" and the Democrats will sit on the sidelines smirking as they get their way yet pay no political price.

I think you hit the nail on the head, oldbill. It won't be pretty for the GOP. You'd think they'd learn from the '06 results, but with the way they're acting - like the new OBL RNC chair - they obviously are continuing their path over the cliff.
21 posted on 11/26/2006 10:16:12 PM PST by CottonBall
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To: CottonBall

I don't understand how anyone can complain about an OBL RNC Chairman. If you voted for Bush in 2004, you're getting exactly what you should expect. What, did you think he's going to appoint someone who will engage in a big public fight against him?


22 posted on 11/26/2006 10:58:24 PM PST by The Old Hoosier (Right makes might)
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To: Laptop_Ron

A true Conservative leader firmly backing the mandate of the base will win election, but none is anywhere to be found.

Heaven and Earth would be moved in support of this future leader.


23 posted on 11/26/2006 10:58:24 PM PST by Stallone (Is There A Conservative Leader ANYWHERE In America?)
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To: VOA

"Unless millions of people come to their senses before it's too late.


We don't need millions to come to their senses, just one with the initials GWB.


24 posted on 11/26/2006 11:02:13 PM PST by Prokopton
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To: neverdem

(yawn) Rich Lowry is a party-line elitist - - nothing surprising here.


25 posted on 11/26/2006 11:07:43 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Moonman62; neverdem
Please read the entire article.

I should have seen your post before I posted #25. I stopped reading when I got to this:

"The lesson from these House races is that a monomaniacal focus on immigration, or too much heavy-breathing rhetoric, turns off voters."

Turns out later that Lowry makes some valid points. My bad.

Regards,
LH

26 posted on 11/26/2006 11:12:54 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: neverdem

btt for later


27 posted on 11/26/2006 11:24:57 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: Lancey Howard; All
I stopped reading when I got to this:

Life is filled with inconvenient facts and opinions. Taking statements out of the context to the exclusion of the remainder of an argument doesn't foster having an informed public discussion, IMHO. It reminds me of the left's twisting of the MSM presentations about any subject. The right isn't going to beat the left without command of all the facts, IMHO.

28 posted on 11/26/2006 11:39:42 PM PST by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: neverdem

The right isn't going to beat the left if we are always on the defensive, either. Time can be spent constantly responding to the lies of the left, or time can be spent attacking and spinning faster than they can keep up. A nice balance is what is needed. IMHO.


29 posted on 11/26/2006 11:55:27 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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An appropriate opportunity for a Filibuster able to get into the World records books.......
30 posted on 11/27/2006 12:12:19 AM PST by wodinoneeye
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To: neverdem

"Republican Randy Graf, a Minuteman, lost a race for a Republican seat, but he was never given a chance by anyone because of his fringy obsession with the issue."

As I understood it, he got no support from the national Republican groups, but there was no reason given. He was campaigning for Jim Kolbe's Republican seat. The GOP just left him to twist in the wind.

"Meanwhile, Republican incumbent J.D. Hayworth, who wrote a book on border enforcement, also lost. Notably, Hayworth was called a "bully" by the editorial board of The Arizona Republic, which had endorsed him in his prior six elections."

J.D. ran a decent campaign and pretty much stuck to the issues. His opponent, a popular former Mayor (of Tempe, I think), ran campaign ads calling J.D. one of the most corrupt Republicans in Congress. Our leftie newspaper saw their chance and trashed him after supporting him for all those years.

Neither one of these losses was firmly based on immigration issues. Graf lost due to lack of national support, and Hayworth lost because he ran against a celebrity with name recognition, while the fence-sitters believed all the airheaded content-free nonsense spewed by the Democrats and the MSM.


31 posted on 11/27/2006 1:41:30 AM PST by Tarantulas ( Illegal immigration - the trojan horse that's treated like a sacred cow)
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To: RussP
And who can we thank for all that? How about so-called "conservatives" like Michael Savage who decided to let their emotions overpower reason. They punished Bush by not voting for Congressional Republicans. Brilliant move there, eh.

You should send your thanks to the LIBnuts at the RNC. You can spread that out by offering thanks to the gaggle of harping monkey two-bit party hacks here, almost as good. They are to blame. Blackbird.

32 posted on 11/27/2006 4:41:47 AM PST by BlackbirdSST (Stay out of the Bushes, unless you're RINO hunting!)
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To: RussP

"They punished Bush by not voting for Congressional Republicans. Brilliant move there, huh?"

And history may repeat itself in a couple years.

A circus animal trainer was making his audience `ooh & ahh'. He told him he was going to ask a bull elephant chained to telephone pole if he wanted a handful of peanuts, then if he would ask him if he wanted a banana.
The trainer whispered in the elephant's ear and the elephant nodded his head up-and-down.
Then he whispered something else and the elephant shook his head side-to-side.

After the show an impressed boy found the trainer and asked him if he was really `talking' to the elephant, and also asked him why he held two bricks in his hands while he did the act.
The trainer replied, "Just between you and me, kid, when this elephant got here, the first thing I did was slam his balls between these two bricks. The next day--as I just did during the act--all I did was ask him if he remembered me.
Then I asked him if he wanted me to do it again."

That's all there is to elections, and the `trick' works with donkeys, too.


33 posted on 11/27/2006 7:56:05 AM PST by OkieDoke ("Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.")
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To: VOA

It is to late...

We'll have this "guest worker" "amnesty" deal before the next hot summer months...

I'm hoping we can DeLay (pardon the pun, I'm a bit partial) this enough to allow this to be quelled somewhat...

But I don't see us being able to stop the pardoning of millions of people who broke our laws, and which will be a considerable boost in the democrat party voting base...

What we see now in the make up of the congress is what we'll have for a long time, if we don't lose a few more seats...

The lines I feel will be drawn at this demographic:

Large to Medium Urban enclaves = liberal voting blocks

Rural America = conservative America

I hope I am wrong...


34 posted on 11/27/2006 9:10:06 AM PST by stevie_d_64 (Houston Area Texans (I've always been hated))
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To: neverdem
"The immigration issue wasn't killing off Republicans; it was discontent with the war and a general disgust with the GOP brand."

Cha-ching.

Az. may have ousted a couple Rs but it passed some very tough anti-Illegal Alien initiatives. It's the 'Dem-Lite' GOP that turns people off. Those that stand true win, like Tancredo did.

35 posted on 11/27/2006 9:20:45 AM PST by moehoward
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To: The Old Hoosier
I don't understand how anyone can complain about an OBL RNC Chairman. If you voted for Bush in 2004, you're getting exactly what you should expect. What, did you think he's going to appoint someone who will engage in a big public fight against him?

You have a point about Bush wanting someone who would agree with him. But I did think the party would've learned something from the election results, even if Bush didn't. Looks like they want to lose again in '08.
36 posted on 11/27/2006 11:16:31 AM PST by CottonBall
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To: CottonBall

And what did they learn from the election results? I'll tell you what they learned. The same district that gave pro-amnesty Bush a majority just turned JD Hayworth out of office.

Bush's pro-amnesty position did not depress base turnout in 2004, but the Tancredo caucus immigration agenda failed to turn out white voters the way JD, Graf, Santorum, John Hostettler and others hoped it would. It's not that their stance killed them -- it just didn't matter.

Politicians like the opponents of all of the above, can allay public fears about immigration just by lying and saying tough-sounding things about illegal immigration.

The issue is a dud. Like it or not, that's the lesson of this election.


37 posted on 11/27/2006 5:57:52 PM PST by The Old Hoosier (Right makes might)
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To: OkieDoke

Well, maybe I'm just dense, but I'm not sure I understand the point of your little story. Whatever it is, I think *you* are missing the point. When you "punish" Respublicans, you reward Democrats. When you reward Democrats, you punish conservatives -- and everyone else, for that matter, in the long run. So conservatives are only shooting themselves in the rear end when they try to "punish" Republicans. In other words, those conservatives who abandon the Republicans are only smashing their own balls. Get it now? If they don't learn that soon, we are all in deep trouble.


38 posted on 11/27/2006 8:33:22 PM PST by RussP
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To: The Old Hoosier
The issue is a dud.

Not hardly. Only about six and a half percent (6.5%) of the members of Cong. Tancredo's Immigration Reform Caucus lost their seats. Weren't somewhere around eleven and a half percent (11.5%) of all Republican seats lost?

How many Democrats that defeated incumbent Republicans that supported H.R.4437 actually ran on a platform of support for both legalization of millions of illegal aliens, as well a path to citizenship for those illegal aliens? Not many. Many Democrats that defeated incumbent Republicans that supported H.R. 4437 attempted to portray themselves as being as tough or tougher than their Republican opponent on illegal immigration and border security.

Those are the lessons of the election.
39 posted on 11/28/2006 11:48:25 AM PST by CottonBall
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To: CottonBall
Only about six and a half percent (6.5%) of the members of Cong. Tancredo's Immigration Reform Caucus lost their seats. Weren't somewhere around eleven and a half percent (11.5%) of all Republican seats lost?

That is totally bogus. They all have safe seats -- the few that don't went down.

How many Democrats that defeated incumbent Republicans that supported H.R.4437 actually ran on a platform of support for both legalization of millions of illegal aliens, as well a path to citizenship for those illegal aliens? Not many.

Yeah, now just watch them all vote for amnesty, deny that it's amnesty, and get away with it.

40 posted on 11/28/2006 11:53:53 AM PST by The Old Hoosier (Right makes might)
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