Posted on 11/20/2006 9:12:06 PM PST by MinorityRepublican
Good lord, if even Henry Kissinger now says that military victory in Iraq is impossible, pretty soon George W. Bush really will be left with just Laura and Barney on his side.
The Decider Agonistes must be feeling betrayed and abused these days. British Prime Minister Tony Blair's admission that the war has been "pretty much of a disaster" was just a slip of the tongue, but the president must have felt it as a cut most unkind.
And Kissinger? The oracle who has been dropping by the White House regularly to whisper sweet nothings into the presidential ear, urging him to hang tough? The sage who wrote in August 2005 that "victory over the insurgency is the only meaningful exit strategy" is now listing Bush's conditions for withdrawal -- a stable government, ruling all of Iraq, with the ability to control the violence -- and pronouncing them unattainable. Will anyone be surprised if Henry the K soon reveals that he knew the whole thing was folly all along?
Meanwhile, the neocon architects of the war are making a spectacle of themselves in their undignified flight from the sinking ship. Richard Perle, Kenneth Adelman, Michael Rubin -- they all take pretty much the same line, which is that the invasion was a great and noble idea but that the White House and the Pentagon bungled it horribly.
Defections, recrimination and finger-pointing among the people who got us into this mess provide an amusing sideshow. But the main event is the mandate that midterm voters imposed this month, in no uncertain terms: Find a way out.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
Surrender now and avoid the rush?
Is this the homo that split the Episcopal Church apart?
As to the argument concerning the danger to our troops were we to withdraw or state that we would, they have also said many times in conjunction with that statement that all of our troops, the moment we set a date, Will be given safe conduct out of Vietnam. The only other important point is that we allow the South Vietnamese people to determine their own future and that ostensibly is what we have been fighting for, anyway.
If we don't withdraw, if we maintain a Korean-type presence in South Vietnam, say 50,000 troops or something, with strategic bombing raids from Guam and from Japan and from Thailand dropping these 15,000 pound fragmentation bombs on them, et cetera, in the next few years, then what you will have is a people who are continually oppressed, who are continually at warfare, and whose problems will not at all be solved because they will not have any kind of representation.
The war will continue. So what I am saying is that yes, there will be some recrimination but far, far less than the 200,000 a year who are murdered by the United States of America, and we can't go around -- President Kennedy said this, many times. He said that the United States simply can't right every wrong, that we can't solve the problems of the other 94 percent of mankind.
You don't have a chance for peace when you arm the people of another country and tell them they can fight a war. That is not peace; that is fighting a war; that is continuing a war. That is even criminal in the sense that this country, if we are really worried about recrimination, is going to have to someday face up to the fact that we convinced a certain number of people, perhaps hundreds of thousands, perhaps there will be several million, that they could stand up to something which they couldn't and ultimately will face the recrimination of the fact that their lives in addition to all the lives at this point, will be on our conscience. I don't think it is a question of peace at all. What we are doing is very, very hypocritical in our withdrawal, and we really should face up to that.
1971 "testimony" of John 'F'in Kerry to the Fulbright anti-war commission.
History just keeps on repeating itself.
What war looks good? How many generals did Lincoln go through? He sure had his dark days. If we had quit after the first 2000 casualties in WWII, we would all be speaking German. Where is our courage? Do only the troops have it?
What a bunch of girlie men politicians we have, with the exception of President Bush.
If we pull out of Iraq, we will never fight again. It's usually the liberals who want us to get involved in settling wars around the earth. No longer will we drop into the Balkans or Somalia.
If Muslim countries attack Israel, we will not act. Israel will stand alone.
If China attacks Taiwan, so be it. We'll sit home & watch the stock market grow.
If China attacks Japan, Japan is toast.
Tony Blair is a politician. His statement is correct. The Iraq war has pretty much been a political disaster for those who instigated and supported it.
Events can be politically a mess and still be correct. Lincoln faced a political disaster, as well.
Republicans have a very powerful voice online.
Unfortunately there are Republicans who feel the need to sponge in this new media with such nonsense as "comprehensive" immigration this, and "moderate" that. Which just basically po's everyone who's online for their news - since we're the ones who long ago gave up on the MSM.
So what happens? Nothing.
We need to stop gibbering about anything containing the word "comprehensive", stop whining about compromising with "moderates" - and start fighting right now.
The Presidential election is starting. Get out there and let's fight this time.
ON THE SAME SIDE.
Why Iraq
One of the really infuriating things in modern politics is the level of disinformation, misinformation, demagoguery and out right lying going on about the mission in Iraq. Democrats have spent the last 3+ years lying about Iraq out of a political calculation. The assumption is that the natural isolationist mindset of the average American voter, linked to the inherent Anti Americanism (what is misnamed the "Anti War movement") of the more feverish Democrat activists (especially those running the US's National "News" media) would restore them to national political dominance. The truth is the Democrat Party Leadership has simply lacked the courage to speak truth to whiners. The truth is that even if Al Gore won the 2000 election and 09-11 still happened we would be doing the EXACT same things in Iraq we are doing now.
Based on the political situation in the region left over from the 1991 Gulf War plus the domestic political consensus built up in BOTH parties since 1991 as well as fundamental military strategic laws, there was NO viable strategic choice for the US but to take out Iraq after finishing the initial operations in Afghanistan.
To start with Saddam's Iraq was our most immediate threat. We could NOT commit significant military forces to another battle with Saddam hovering undefeated on our flank nor could we leave significant forces watching Saddam. The political containment of Iraq was breaking down. That what Oil for Food was all about. Oil for Food was an attempt by Iraq to break out of it's diplomatic isolation and slip the shackles the UN Sanctions put on it's military. There there was the US Strategic position to consider.
The War on Islamic Fascism is different sort of war. in facing this Asymmetrical threat, we have a hidden foe, spread out across a geographically diverse area, with covert sources of supply. Since we cannot go everywhere they hide out, in fact often cannot even locate them until the engage us, we need to draw them out of hiding into a kill zone.
Iraq is that kill zone. That is the true brilliance of the Iraq strategy. We draw the terrorists out of their world wide hiding places onto a battlefield they have to fight on for political reasons (The "Holy" soil of the Arabian peninsula) where they have to pit their weakest ability (Conventional Military combat power) against our greatest strength (ability to call down unbelievable amounts of firepower) where they will primarily have to fight other forces (the Iraqi Security forces) in a battlefield that is mostly neutral in terms of guerrilla warfare. (Iraqi-mostly open terrain as opposed to guerrilla friendly areas like the mountains of Afghanistan or the jungles of SE Asia).
Did any of the critics of liberating Iraq ever look at a map? Iraq, for which we had the political, legal and moral justifications to attack, is the strategic high ground of the Middle East. A Geographic barrier that severs ground communication between Iran and Syria apart as well as providing another front of attack in either state or into Saudi Arabia if needed.
There were other reasons to do Iraq but here is the strategic military reason we are in Iraq. We have taken, an maintain the initiative from the Terrorists. They are playing OUR game on ground of OUR choosing.
Problem is Counter Insurgency is SLOW and painful. Often a case of 3 steps forward, two steps back. One has to wonder if the American people have either the emotional maturity, nor the intellect" to understand. It's so much easier to spew made for TV slogans like "No Blood for Oil" or "We support the Troops, bring them home" or dumbest of all "We are creating terrorists" then to actually THINK.
Westerners in general, and the US citizens in particular seem to have trouble grasping the fundamental fact of this foe. These Islamic Fascists have NO desire to co-exist with them. The extremists see all this PC posturing by the Hysteric Left as a sign that we are weak. Since they want us dead, weakness encourages them. There is simply no way to coexist with people who completely believe their "god" will reward them for killing us.
So we can covert to Islam, die or kill them. Iraq is about killing enough of them to make the rest of the Jihadists realize we are serious. They same way killing enough Germans, Italians and Japanese eliminated the ideologies of Nazism, Fascism and Bushido.
Americans need to understand how Bin Laden and his ilk view us. In the Arab world the USA is considered a big wimp. We have run away so many times. Lebanon, the Kurds, the Iraqis in 1991, the Iranians, Somalia, Clinton all thru the 1990s etc etc etc. The Jihadists think we will run again. In fact they are counting on it. That way they can run around screaming "We beat the American just like the Russians, come join us in Jihad" and recruit the next round of "holy warriors". Iraq is also a show place where we show the Muslim world that there are a lines they cannot cross. On 9-11-01 they crossed that line and we can, and will, destroy them for it
Everyone just shut the hell up about Iraq.
Seriously. Shut. the. hell. up.
This basically applies to 99% of all people. 99% of people talking about Iraq, don't know what the hell they are talking about, aren't affected by the situation anyway, and thus simply need to shut the hell up.
The people doing the loudest complaining about Iraq, and who keep whining that we "need to get out", such as Eugene Robinson I assume, are (typically) the people whose lives are being completely and totally unaffected by the fact that we have a military presence in Iraq. And, they don't know what the hell they are talking about.
There is simply far too much yammering and far too little shutting the hell up.
Mr. Eugene Robinson, if we have a military presence in Iraq for the next 25 years, what the hell is it to you? 30 years? 50 years? Seriously, why do you care?
Same question for 99% of people.
If anti-occupation people can't answer that question with an answer more tangible than "well, it makes the news icky and unpleasanat", they need to shut. the. hell. up.
There is simply no reason for so many coddled, sheltered people with cushy lives which have been COMPLETELY UNAFFECTED BY THE IRAQ MILITARY PRESENCE (and this description fits a majority of Americans) to have spent these last 3 1/2 years endlessly, neverendingly, constantly whining about the Iraq military presence. Well, is there?
So please, and I am being completely serious here, it's time to put the "everyone just shut the hell up" option on the table. Let the military do their thing, just as we let the Post Office do their thing, without endlessly whining and handwringing and backseat driving. Whether the military, as led by their Commander in Chief, chooses to have a presence in Iraq or Croatia or Okinawa is about as relevant to the lives of most Americans as whether the Post Office puts out an Elvis stamp or a woodpecker stamp. The Eugene Robinsons of the world need not pay attention nor give their input; it is not required, nor is it helping, and for crying out loud, it's not even affecting them in the first place.
I know I sound like I'm being facetious but I sincerely believe that if my prescription were followed, and everyone (or at least 99% of people) just shut the hell up about Iraq, it would benefit both us, and Iraq.
Hey, I can dream.
Some where the ghost of LBJ is laughing his butt off watching another generation of DC machine politicians trying to screw up their war the same way he tried to micromanage Vietnam. GET OUT OF THE WAY. That is how DC can "Fix" Iraq.
No one is "losing" anything. MAYBE instead of just echoing the utter nonsense on Iraq spewed forth by the Junk Media Conservatives should try finding out the facts on Iraq and start speaking Truth to Whiners.
Gen Abizaid, who came from Iraq to DC last week, told the blunt truth to political grandstander's like John McCain and Hillary Clinton. It would be wise if all the Iraq Know Nothings shut up and listen to what the Military Commanders are telling DC.
Maybe instead of faithfully repeating the propaganda lines spewed at them by the Junk Media "Conservatives" might finally grow a pair and start speaking truth to whiners on Iraq.
Want to "fix Iraq"? The DC political whores and their junk media lap dogs should sit down, shut up and FINALLY start doing some REAL Journalism on Iraq instead of mindlessly repeated the Democrat talking points as "fact". Most of what people here think they "know" about Iraq is total nonsense.
People could try reading any of the dozens of articles Freeper Sandrat posts here every day. Try these links for some REAL facts for a change.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Security_Forces
http://icasualties.org/oif/
http://icasualties.org/oif/IraqiDeaths.aspx
Ultra Mega Dittos. Well said.
As you say, the election showed that the country is closely divided. The problem is that the "thinkers" and politicians in DC are stampeding. The concept of national honor may not mean much to the likes of this guy, or to the emerging cut-and-run consensus, but if we repeat our diagraceful repudiation of the South Vietnamese government, then this time we will lose not only "face" but our very power to affect events in the world.
Both, actually, although that number may be a bit optimistic. But not many more votes than that properly distributed would have returned a Republican majority in at least the Senate. What has been proclaimed a tidal wave was nothing of the sort, and it's the reason Rove remained optimistic until the count came in. The Republicans lost a lot of close elections, but the bottom line is that they lost a lot of elections. That's the way the system is set up and I'm not complaining.
I think the time has come to try to understand what liberals really are. It is they who frustrate efforts to avoid annihilation of the United States even though that the threat and certainty of domestic attack grows daily. Our border is still porous. Republicans tried to appeal to the intelligence of the American people but boredom and jokes at Bush and fear of being hated or laughed at for being too patriotic or just being thought of in an intensely negative fashion (a fear intensified by the MSM) at least confused if not broke the will of many voters. How do we fight these manipulators? When your favorite comedian is gnashing his teeth or repeatedly jokes about the administration, that carries weight. No one wants to be laughed at or feel foolish. This level of emotional intimidation and brainwashing is unprecedented and distrust of the media should never let up.
These "reporters" don't have a clue.
I axe myself -burp- I axe myself, 'can we kill'em tomorrow'?
If we can kill'em tomorrow, we ain't backin' down. Get it?
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