The A380 - Dumbo.
Posted on 10/28/2006 4:04:56 PM PDT by smonk
By JAMES WALLACE P-I AEROSPACE REPORTER
The Boeing Co.'s 787 Dreamliner is not the only jetliner in development that needs to go on a diet.
The double-decker A380, the 555-passenger giant from Airbus that has been delayed for up to two years by what Airbus has said are wiring problems, is about 5.5 tons overweight, a senior executive with an airline that has ordered the plane disclosed Friday.
Airbus has not previously acknowledged that its flagship new jet is significantly heavier than customers were promised.
Tim Clark, president of Emirates Airlines, which has ordered 43 of the superjumbos, revealed the weight problems while speaking Friday to reporters at Heathrow Airport in London.
"We have not yet engaged with Airbus as regards not only the delay but the fact that it is overweight," Clark told reporters, according to a Reuters report. He was in London for the opening of a new lounge at Heathrow Airport that will be used by A380 passengers.
Airbus has blamed a series of delays in getting the A380 ready for customers on wiring issues. But some industry analysts have speculated that wiring alone could not fully explain why the plane is two years behind schedule.
Richard Aboulafia, vice president of analysis for the Teal Group, an industry consulting business in Fairfax, Va., said it is now clear there are additional problems.
"This is big news," he said of the revelation by Clark that the A380 is 5.5 tons too heavy.
That's the equivalent of about 55 passengers who weigh 200 pounds each, Aboulafia noted.
advertising "This goes a long way in explaining the delay," Aboulafia said. "Wiring alone did not explain what we were all hearing. It sounds like weight-reduction design changes are a big part of the delay, too."
The first A380 was supposed to have been delivered to Singapore Airlines early this year. The airline won't get the first plane until next October, Airbus has said.
Emirates will be the second airline to get A380s. But that won't happen until 2008. Under the original Airbus delivery schedule, Emirates would have had 18 A380s by the time it will now get its first plane, Clark said.
The airline is sending its own audit team to Toulouse, France, home of Airbus, to investigate the delays and determine how realistic the latest A380 delivery schedule is, Clark told reporters. The A380 problems led to a major management shake-up at Airbus this summer. The top executive resigned. His replacement recently resigned, too.
Weight is a problem with all new aircraft development programs. A heavier plane burns more fuel. Range and payload are affected.
Earlier this week, Boeing said its 787 Dreamliner is 2 percent to 3 percent over the target weight, and a team is working on the problem. Boeing would not say how many pounds that percentage represents.
"We considered whether we should give out a figure, but it literally changes by the week and sometimes by the day," a Boeing spokeswoman said Friday.
Final assembly of the Dreamliner won't start for several months. That makes it easier for engineers to look for ways to get the weight out. But the A380 is already in flight testing.
Typically, launch customers for an all-new jet from Boeing or Airbus get performance guarantees written in their contracts, with financial penalties if the plane is too heavy and does not perform as promised.
Clark would not comment on any financial compensation that Emirates might seek from Airbus because of the A380 delays and the weight problem.
And he did not sound convinced that there won't be more delays.
"It would be foolish to say we do not expect anything further," he was quoted as saying when asked if there could be a fourth A380 delay announcement from Airbus.
Clark also was asked about the A350XWB, the plane that Airbus has said it will develop to challenge Boeing's 787 as well as the bigger 777.
In July, Airbus announced that it would redesign the A350 in response to customers' criticism that the previous design was not good enough to challenge the 787.
Clark said the latest version of the A350XWB (extra wide body) is still lacking. Emirates has been considering a 100-plane order for either the 787 or A350.
Meanwhile, Airbus does not have a plane to seriously challenge either the 787 or the bigger 777.
This was underscored again Friday when Emirates announced that it has canceled a $4.2 billion order for 10 of the Airbus A340-600 models and dropped options for eight more.
The A380 - Dumbo.
Will Airbus' solution be more GLARE all around?
Another question: it barely failed its wingloading test before. Will reducing its weight help or hinder the next wingloading test? I guess it all depends on if the wing actually had to bear the weight of the entire plane body during the test.
I'd guess that no one would take delivery of any airframe already in planning &/or there's going to be a hell of a lot of scrappage (added cost) and delay for replacements before anything actually gets a logo painted on it.
I'm betting that some of the extra weight is from having strengthened the wings after they failed the wingload test. I guess they just didn't bother shaving weight somewhere else to make up for it.
Boeing says some of their extra weight is from strengthening the wings against lightning strikes -- but at least they have a solid plan (and eight contingency plans) to still get the plane out on time and at weight.
You make a great point. Boeing's gotten out in front and admitted that the 787 is coming in about 1% to 1.5% overweight, same as the A380. The difference is, like you said, there *aren't* any 787's yet. Boeing can go back and fix the problem behind the scenes instead of under the public scrutiny that Airbus is facing.
There's going to be screwups in any huge program like the 787 or A380, that's the nature of the beast. They'll never run 100% smoothly. But these announcements from Airbus are coming way, way too late in the game. Boeing seems to be on top of their problems, Airbus either shoved them off or didn't know about them until far too late.
}:-)4
Or about 30 American passengers.
Or about 30 American passengers.
Or 1 Rosie O'Donnell.
Or 1/2 Michael Moore.
For me, the key question is who knew what when:
They simply need to use a lot more unobtainium in the structure -- twice the strength, half the weight, and no additional charge. Just send Boeing and Airbus a bunch of this unobtanium, and all their problems will be solved.
Lessee... if we take the average weight of a passenger (+luggage) to be 200 lbs, that's about 55 seats less than the maximum the beancounters would force the airlines to outfit the planes with.
Not a bad deal...
I guess they've got a bunch of analog data travelling down analog lines - because if they digitized everything, they could send their data over fiber optic lines [which weigh next to nothing] or even go wireless.
I wondered why they didn't choose fiber myself. and the whole wiring problem is all about the entertainment system, of all things.
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