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To: LexBaird
WOW! you took an awful lot of logorrhea to completely miss the point.

You stipulated that the raw materials were available.

Graphite is not a raw material. It is a manufactured substance.

. Gosh, I guess I'll have to smelt some ore, forge some billets and sharpen a resulting chunk of steel. The question was "how do you make a pencil from raw materials

I was trying to elicit thought (obviously unsuccessfully in your case) about the complexities of manufacturing even a simple object like a pencil. The point was that even a pencil requires materials and machinery (the knife in your simplistic example) that are either beyond the means or beyone the skills of most individuals to manufacture. You need trading partners to get the materials and the machinery to manufacture even a lowly pencil. You can pay more or you can pay less, or you can waste your labor in trying to make on yourself, but unless you go for the cheapest alternative you are going to be missing out on capital or lifstyle.

. The safety and economy of the U.S. may not rely upon pencils, but it does rely upon steel and heavy industrial products, and abandoning the ability to produce these is as short sighted ...

Not true at all. If foreign producers can compete with domestic steel after you factor in the shipping costs, you have to ask yourself why can't us manufacturers beat the price? The answer is if they adopt the same methods dump the union featherbedding they can. So the answer is not to prop up an inefficient industry with taxes, but let it compete. Tariffs to protect inefficient and union ruined industries are like paying welfare queens to have more bastards. If you reward the stupid behavior, then you get more of it.

153 posted on 10/25/2006 9:21:57 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your most dangerous enemy is your own government)
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To: from occupied ga
Graphite is not a raw material. It is a manufactured substance.

Graphite is a naturally occurring form of carbon. It can also be manufactured, as can diamonds, which are also naturally occurring forms of carbon. Strictly speaking, I can make a pencil from a chunk of pure graphite dug from the ground and sharpened by rubbing it on a rock.

I was trying to elicit thought (obviously unsuccessfully in your case) about the complexities of manufacturing even a simple object like a pencil. The point was that even a pencil requires materials and machinery (the knife in your simplistic example) that are either beyond the means or beyone the skills of most individuals to manufacture.

Your point was obtuse and irrelevant. No one is advocating individual and personal manufacturing of every item. That's why I said your argument was a red herring.

You can pay more or you can pay less, or you can waste your labor in trying to make on yourself, but unless you go for the cheapest alternative you are going to be missing out on capital or lifstyle.

Nonsense of the same sort that Williams employed: logical fallacy of false dilemma. That would only hold true if expense, or "cheapness" was the only variable component of lifestyle. Reliability, availability and quality are just a few other variables. How cheap are the tires on your car? How cheap are they when you factor in the cost of accidents caused by blowouts?

Likewise, how cheap is foreign steel when the transportation gets interdicted and domestic sources cannot be found for any price?

162 posted on 10/25/2006 9:51:06 AM PDT by LexBaird (98% satisfaction guaranteed. There's just no pleasing some people.)
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