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"Bravo Papa!" -- The Pope, the Prophet Mohammed, and the Jews
Israel Insider ^ | October 10, 2006 | Isi Leibler

Posted on 10/10/2006 12:21:23 PM PDT by SJackson

In what will probably become one of his defining speeches on Christian Moslem relations, Pope Benedict XVI ignited a hornets nest by incorporating a quotation from a fourteenth century Orthodox Byzantine Emperor alleging that the Prophet Mohammed promoted "things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

The Pontiff is neither naïve nor a fool. Everything that is ever said by or on behalf of the Pope is calculated and thought through to the very end. He was aware that offensive selective quotes can be found to demonize any and all religions and that his intervention would hardly represent a prescription for promoting interfaith dialogue. The Pope also knows that in historical terms Christianity would hardly qualify as a religion of tolerance.

Nor is Islam a monolithic religion. It incorporates a wide variety of interpretations of the Koran with starkly differing approaches prevailing at various periods. For example during the so called Golden Age in Spain, Christian Crusaders were brutally exterminating Moslems and Jews in the name of God, at the same time as Jews and Moslems were coexisting in relative harmony.

The Pope's intervention was designed to convey a message. He and his Vatican advisers surely knew from previous experience that this speech would enrage Moslems and lead to a disproportionate response. Yet, despite the murder of a nun, the torching of churches, and calls for the Pontiff to be beheaded, he refused to retract his remarks. He merely stated that he did not endorse the quote about the Prophet and was "deeply sorry" for the pain it caused Moslems.

The Pope was at pains to reiterate his central message that violence separates faith from reason, and that Jihad, holy wars, or religiously motivated violence were contrary to God's will. He insisted that if dialogue was to be meaningful, Christians and Moslems must be enabled to discuss their respective concepts of God and religion in an open manner.

Today, most Christians oppose violence, but many Moslems endorse the violent Jihadist upsurge and tolerate terrorism. The obscene hatred that spews from numerous Imams against infidels, and Jews in particular, inevitably culminates with violence.

The first major global manifestation of such violence in our times was the Fatwa issued against a lapsed Moslem, Salman Rushdie, calling for his execution for having written a satire on Mohammed. Since then, violence has become par for the course, with many Islamic clerics competing with one another to sanctify martyrdom to promote the faith. Moderate Moslems are intimidated and remained in the closet even when murderous Islamic bodies carry out acts of terror.

The incredible cowardice displayed by Western leaders in the face of the religiously inspired violence over the Danish cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed demonstrated the extent to which Europeans in particular, have simply capitulated to brutal intimidation. This was also exemplified when, in the face of Moslem threats of violence, the Berlin Opera House recently cancelled a performance of a Mozart opera containing offensive satiric references to Christ and Mohammed.

In this environment, it is somewhat sickening to observe Western politicians and religious leaders still monotonously repeating the false mantra that contemporary Islam is a religion of peace.

The reality is that many Moslems including those domiciled in Europe and in other democratic countries, who enjoy the privileges denied to infidels in Islamic countries, either endorse or remain silent in the face of the brutal violence, intolerance, and triumphalism expressed by their clerics and lay leaders. Shiites and Sunnis alike are subject to brainwashing by extremist Mullahs in the cult of death and martyrdom. Not surprisingly, the more impressionable youngsters succumb to the indoctrination with a number actually becoming perpetrators of terrorism. If these trends are not soon reversed, violent confrontations will inevitably erupt between Moslem minorities and the societies hosting them.

Clearly Pope Benedict XVI is concerned that, at a time when secularism is undermining Christianity, Islamic fundamentalists are making dramatic inroads and beginning to constitute a real threat to the Church, especially in Europe.

He is distressed that the world remains silent whilst Christians in Moslem countries are being persecuted. When a Moslem converting to Christianity in Afghanistan is condemned to be beheaded; when churches and houses of worship for Hindus, Buddhists and Jews are set aflame; when Moslem minorities in Europe brutally reject democratic procedures and agitate towards imposing Shariah law; when Imams openly justify and endorse terror; when Anjem Choudray, head of the umbrella body of British Moslem organizations in a rally outside Westminster Abbey, calls for the Pontiff to be executed -- Pope Benedict finally came to the realization that continued appeasement spells disaster for the Church.

The Pope's extraordinary intervention is his way of saying enough is enough. His clear underlying message is to indulge in a dialogue of faith and reason which would lead to a demand for reciprocity, insisting that Islamic countries provide other religions with the same rights Moslem minorities enjoy in Christian nations.

Where should Jews stand in relation to this? Obviously with Moslems loudly proclaiming that the Pope is a Zionist stooge and is being manipulated by the Jews, we have no reason to become embroiled in this conflict.

At the same time, any initiative which exposes the lie that Islam as practiced today is a religion of peace, warrants our support.

In this context, it was appalling that the Israeli Sephardic Chief Rabbi, Shlomo Amar, degraded us by sending a demeaning communication disassociating himself from the Pope to a Qatari Islamic cleric renowned for advocating violence and suicide bombings.

In order to curry favor and gain newspaper headlines, some of the Jewish Interfaith bodies have also been issuing bizarre statements about peace loving Moslems. The World Jewish Congress must have bewildered Pope Benedict when they recently requested him to act as an intermediary to bring about Moslem Jewish dialogue, informing him that "ninety nine percent of all Moslems reject all forms of violence". Such groveling approaches by Jews in the name of interfaith dialogue are utterly counterproductive and shame us.

Today, those Western leaders lacking the courage to publicly support the Pontiff are upholding a false form of political correctness and doing themselves a disservice. By kowtowing to blackmail and refusing to condemn Islamic violence, they are encouraging the fanatics into believing that their intimidating tactics will achieve their objective of subjugating the world.

I am no champion of Popes. But on the same grounds that we condemn the cowardly silence of Pope Pius X11 during the Holocaust, we should commend Pope Benedict for having had the courage to confront Hitler's Islamic Fundamentalist successors who today threaten civilization and Jews in particular. For that reason, on this occasion, I have no hesitation in saying "Bravo Papa!"


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: benedictxvi; catholic; crushislam; isileibler; islam; muslims; pope; trop; wot
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1 posted on 10/10/2006 12:21:23 PM PDT by SJackson
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To: SJackson
Nor is Islam a monolithic religion. It incorporates a wide variety of interpretations of the Koran with starkly differing approaches prevailing at various periods. For example during the so called Golden Age in Spain, Christian Crusaders were brutally exterminating Moslems and Jews in the name of God, at the same time as Jews and Moslems were coexisting in relative harmony.

BS ALERT!!!!

Dear Editor:

“There, (in Spain) the Muslims represented an advanced, regionally dominant and self-confident civilization. Like many Westerners today, they had the magnanimity of the mighty."

Muslim Spain was Christian Spain for nearly 700 years before being conquered by Islamic Armies in the 8th Century. That is the way the Islamic Religion has been historically spread, though military invasion and occupation. Treatment of conquered people has the same goal, the minimizing of other religions and conversion of the indigenous people. Among other rules for non Muslims in Muslim Spain; Christians and Jews could not bear arms -- Muslims could; Christians and Jews could not ride horses -- Muslims could; Christians and Jews had to get permission to build or fix places or worship -- Muslims did not; Christians and Jews had to pay certain taxes which Muslims did not; Christians could not proselytize -- Muslims could; Christians and Jews had to bow to their Muslim masters; Christians and Jews had to live under the laws set forth in the Koran, not under either their own religious or secular law; Christian’s and Jew's word in a court of law was not equal to a Muslim's Word; Christian and Jewish families had to give up a son for conversion and military service in Muslim armies and the most beautiful and largest Christian Churches were converted to Mosques. And the list goes on.

Today, 1300 years later, a Christian or Jew living in an Islamic country will still have to live nearly under these very same laws.

Maybe the Danes don’t want to live like Christians and Jews once did (and do) in an Islamic society.

Regards,

2banana

2 posted on 10/10/2006 12:28:38 PM PDT by 2banana
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To: SJackson

Good article. Thanks for posting it.


3 posted on 10/10/2006 12:31:11 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

High volume. Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking on the Topic or Keyword Israel. also

2006israelwar or WOT

..................

4 posted on 10/10/2006 12:35:08 PM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: SJackson
"The World Jewish Congress must have bewildered Pope Benedict when they recently requested him to act as an intermediary to bring about Moslem Jewish dialogue"

Pope Benedict is not bewildered by anything. He sees clearly the separation of conservative Jews and Christians from liberal Jews and Christians who celebrate "diversity." Remember that this Pope was the one who closed the cafeteria. Ironically, liberal American Catholics continue to line up outside the cafeteria door thinking their meal tickets are still good.

5 posted on 10/10/2006 12:36:31 PM PDT by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: SJackson
For example during the so called Golden Age in Spain, Christian Crusaders were brutally exterminating Moslems and Jews in the name of God, at the same time as Jews and Moslems were coexisting in relative harmony.

NOBODY who actually studied the history of Spain would say this.

The Muslim Moors invaded Spain, conquered the native inhabitants, and drove the last small group of Christians into the northern mountains. It took them 900 years of struggle to drive the Muslims out of their country. 900 years of heroism, betrayals, and tragic setbacks.

Sure, the Muslims occasionally tolerated Christians and Jews, as long as they stayed in their subordinate places, bowed when their masters passed by, paid their taxes, and the rest. But if anyone broke these rules, they would go into a village and kill Jews or Christians, never mind of they were guilty of the "crime" or not. Much like their behavior today, when they kill a bunch of Christians in Pakistan because they don't like what they have been told about Danish cartoons.

In the end, the Jews got caught in the middle, between the Christians and Muslims, who continued to be a serious threat in their pirate headquarters in North Africa. But those Jews were expelled, not killed, in 1492. Not to excuse it, but it was understandable, after centuries of bloody fighting for their very survival.

6 posted on 10/10/2006 12:37:01 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: SJackson
by incorporating a quotation from a fourteenth century Orthodox Byzantine Emperor

This may seem childish but it is nice to see someone finally knowing and acknowledging that he was Orthodox. First time I have seen it in the press.

7 posted on 10/10/2006 12:37:41 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: SJackson
In order to curry favor and gain newspaper headlines, some of the Jewish Interfaith bodies have also been issuing bizarre statements about peace loving Moslems. The World Jewish Congress must have bewildered Pope Benedict when they recently requested him to act as an intermediary to bring about Moslem Jewish dialogue, informing him that "ninety nine percent of all Moslems reject all forms of violence". Such groveling approaches by Jews in the name of interfaith dialogue are utterly counterproductive and shame us.

Btw, this made me feel better about the behavior of some of my fellow Orthodox in the region.

8 posted on 10/10/2006 12:39:46 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: 2banana

Christians and Jews living in "harmony" with Islam necessitates inferior status. Spain was "comfortable" to Jews only by comparison to other locales. That's one of a couple questionable points in the article, I'd object to the "we" referring to Pope Pius XII, but in general I liked it.


9 posted on 10/10/2006 12:41:28 PM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: MarMema
This may seem childish but it is nice to see someone finally knowing and acknowledging that he was Orthodox. First time I have seen it in the press.

Not childish. Wonder what percentage of high school seniors would have a clue as to the distinction?

10 posted on 10/10/2006 12:42:23 PM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: 2banana
Excellent. The problem is that history as taught even in "Catholic" universities don't reflect the facts that you lay down. Therefore, even the professor-ate shares the Voltairian delusions about the nature of Islam. But the indifferent and distant god of the philosophers is very different from Mohammed's God, who commands that all men be brought by force of arms into subjection to Him. The apostles of individual freedom are thus brought into alliance with the apostles of universal slavery.
11 posted on 10/10/2006 12:47:00 PM PDT by RobbyS ( CHIRHO)
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To: Cicero

See post 9. I can only assume he's speaking relatively, Jews being banned from England, France, and the Holy Roman Empire. Dhimmi status might be preferable to expulsion when there's nowhere to go. Other than Eastern Europe, the Ottoman Empire, and Spain.


12 posted on 10/10/2006 12:47:11 PM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: SJackson
Wonder what percentage of high school seniors would have a clue as to the distinction?

Well my kids know. But I suppose that is hardly fair.

13 posted on 10/10/2006 12:56:14 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: SJackson

Maybe the cartoon protesters are to be handed over to the Inquisition - it knew how to handle such baboonery.


14 posted on 10/10/2006 1:14:30 PM PDT by GSlob
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To: SJackson
The Pope also knows that in historical terms Christianity would hardly qualify as a religion of tolerance.

You know, this reference to the Crusades always gets me going. Was this time a stain on Christianity? Yes, however one must go back to the time of the Crusades to find a time of organized and approved Christian violence. One need only turn on the news to see daily examples of organized and approved Muslim violence.

Second, the violence of the Crusades was committed in contradiction to the teachings of Christ. The violence committed by Muslims is in accordance with the teachings of the Koran.

15 posted on 10/10/2006 1:21:05 PM PDT by Sergio (If a tree fell on a mime in the forest, would he make a sound?)
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To: Sergio

You're right, Christian violence has been far more political by nature, not mandated by scripture.


16 posted on 10/10/2006 1:42:26 PM PDT by SJackson (The Pilgrims—Doing the jobs Native Americans wouldn't do!)
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To: SJackson

Great article. Thx for posting it.


17 posted on 10/10/2006 2:01:39 PM PDT by Dark Skies (Allah sez "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.")
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To: Sergio

Agreed!


18 posted on 10/10/2006 2:05:38 PM PDT by Frank_2001
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To: Sergio
There were a lot of folks being burned at the stake during and after the Reformation, which came a long time after the last of the crusades.

Of course, that's not the major point of the article. The gravamen of this column is that Benedict recognizes that it is time to draw a line in the sand and hold that line, otherwise, Christians and Jews are going to be forced into hiding.

What I really don't get are the feminists, the gays, and other left wing types who caterwaul about the USA fighting the Islamic menace when it is clear that they will be the first ones put to the sword if the world becomes Muslim.
19 posted on 10/10/2006 2:24:13 PM PDT by Tom D. (Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. - Benj. Franklin)
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To: SJackson
In order to curry favor and gain newspaper headlines, some of the Jewish Interfaith bodies have also been issuing bizarre statements about peace loving Moslems. The World Jewish Congress must have bewildered Pope Benedict when they recently requested him to act as an intermediary to bring about Moslem Jewish dialogue, informing him that "ninety nine percent of all Moslems reject all forms of violence". Such groveling approaches by Jews in the name of interfaith dialogue are utterly counterproductive and shame us.

It's hard to believe that any Jewish group would take these positions. It's like going back to reminince fondly about Hitler's love for little doggies.

When a group or religion is hell-bent on genocide against your people, that is no time to make nicey-talk. Kill their leaders, crush them economically, bomb them into the Stone Age. Then when they're huddling in the ruins, trembling with fear, only then can you make some nicey-talk about their wonderful Religion Of Peace.

Rinse and repeat until the barbarians understand the lesson.
20 posted on 10/10/2006 2:28:57 PM PDT by George W. Bush
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