Journalists' Forced Conversion Not Contrary to Islam

Human Events ^ | August 30, 2006 | Robert Spencer

[Scotswife]

"From what I've found ... any iman, who can simply be a prayer leader, can issue any fatwa they choose ... and any Muslim can choose to believe or not to believe in the authority for that iman and whatever fatwas they issue."

So what was the deal with that poor guy in Afghanistan who converted to christianity, and nearly the whole world intervened to stop his execution.
Who issued that death sentence?

[RS]

"Who issued that death sentence?"

I don't believe that an official death sentance by the Afgan Government was ever issued, some of the crazy imans were pressuring them, and the government found a way out of the showdown, without telling the nuts to simply to buzz off.


The Afghani Constitution states has provisions that would appear to be points in conflict. -

Article 2 [Religions]
(1) The religion of the state of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan is the sacred religion of Islam.
(2) Followers of other religions are free to exercise their faith and perform their religious rites within the limits of the provisions of law.

Article 3 [Law and Religion]
In Afghanistan, no law can be contrary to the beliefs and provisions of the sacred religion of Islam.


The Imans wanted to test this and see who has the ultimate power and the government pulled an end-run on them.

This is a good thing.

[Scotswife]

This article states it is a crime punishable by death to convert from Islam to christianity....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,,1734776,00.html

[RS]

Yep, under the Shariah laws, but they are not the law in Afganistan - which is why the next sentance -

"The trial is thought to be the first of its kind in Afghanistan and highlights a struggle between religious conservatives and reformists over what shape Islam will take four years after the fall of the Taliban."

As I mentioned, in this case, the FIRST of it's kind, the government was able to out-maneuver the religious fanatics.

Court cases may well have to decide IF shariah laws are to be considered "the beliefs and provisions of the sacred religion of Islam" as it states in their Constitution.

[Scotswife]

So...Sharia law is the law of the Islamic religion...but not necessarily the law of Islamic governments?
What is the basis for Sharia law?

[RS]

"So...Sharia law is the law of the Islamic religion..."

Where did you find that ?

This might help clear up your misconception - http://lexicorient.com/e.o/sharia.htm

"One sees traces of many non-Muslim juridical systems in the Sharia, such as Old Arab Bedouin law, commercial law from Mecca, agrarian law from Madina, law from the conquered countries, Roman law and Jewish law."

[HitmanLV]

Pingster!

[elcid1970]

Look, I'm not trying to demand that Steve Centanni stand rock solid and reject conversion to Islam at sword's point,

But what if he did.... and the Islamofascists sawed his head off in retaliation.

Theyr'd soon be a lot of dead, or soon to be dead, Islamomuzzies.

Real martyrdom counts. Ask the Christian victims. I've already volunteered for Iraq. I'm not kidding, ask my commanding oficer.

ISLAM IS AS ISLAM DOES!

[Victoria Delsoul]

This is very interesting and worth repeating:

Indeed, few in the West know what’s going on regarding the example of Muhammad and the stance of traditional Islam on conversion. The human rights should have the courage to recognize and denounce this conversion-or-else directive, and to recognize the plight of those who even today suffer from its scourge.

Absolutely. And that's exactly the point I've been trying to make in the last few days. The conversion is INVALID to us westerners, but it is definitely VALID to Muslims.

The rationale upon which the video of their conversion was made, was based on the premise that the Koran not only recognizes forced conversion, but promotes them.

Take this article for example and its subsequent quotes:

Muhammad instructed his followers to call people to Islam before waging war against them—the warfare would follow from their refusal to accept Islam or to enter the Islamic social order as inferiors, required to pay a special tax (Sahih Muslim 4294). There is therefore a threat in this “invitation” to accept Islam. Would one who converted to Islam under the threat of war be considered to have converted under duress? No; from the standpoint of traditional schools of Islamic jurisprudence, such a conversion would have resulted from “no compulsion.”

Muhammad reinforced these instructions many times during his prophetic career. Late in his career, he wrote to Heraclius, the Eastern Roman Emperor in Constantinople: “Embrace Islam and you will be safe” (Bukhari, 4.52.191). Heraclius did not accept Islam, and soon the Byzantines would know well that the warriors of jihad indeed granted no safety to those who rejected their “invitation.”

If by making a video under duress, and if it is viewed by Muslims in general as a valid conversion, then Centanni and Wiig have a moral obligation to publicly denounce it - not to us westerners – but to the Muslims.

Someone told me yesterday - something I've been listening all too frequent lately... Oh, but you would've done the same thing in their place... What were they supposed to do? It's easy for you to say that, etc. etc. Well, I said, I'm not questioning their “conversion,” I don't even know if they are Christians... that's not my point. I'm questioning their nonchalant attitude after they were released.

They are professional journalists working in Gaza. They know the culture, they report on their cause and struggle, so they also should have a good understanding of what constitutes Islam. And for journalists working vehemently to get the Palestinians' side of the story, it stretches the boundaries of the imagination to believe that upon their release they didn't know what was going on.

And if they are afraid to publicly renounce Islam for fear of getting killed next time the terrorists catch them, then, they have already been converted to Islam even if it's through fear. As a matter of fact, fear and punishment are an intrinsic component to the Koran.

However, that's not the point either. The point is to publicly renounce their “conversion” as an expression of defiance, and not submit in fear and announce their highest respect for Islam.

Remember, Hilal, the spokesman for the Palestinian government, told Reuters: “Good efforts to free the two journalists are continuing. Things are still going in a positive manner and information confirms the two journalists are in good health and are unharmed.”

But Centanni's recount of events paint a different picture. Here again, words like “conversion” and “unharmed” have different meaning in the West and the Arab world:

“In a phone call with Fox News, Centanni said they were abducted Aug. 14 by four masked gunmen on a side street in Gaza City. He said the assailants covered his head with a black hood, and crammed him and Wiig into a small car.

“Their possessions were taken, and their wrists were bound behind their backs. "I still have some sore wrists," he said. "It was digging into my wrists really badly."

“In captivity, Centanni said, he was laid face down in a dark garage and tied up in painful positions.

"If we tried to get up and sit up, which I did do a few times, they would eventually just force us back down with something stuck to my head," he said. "I don't know if it was a stick, a flashlight or a gun or what. We couldn't see. We were forced to lay face down again in the dirt with blindfolds on."

Granted, they weren't killed, but by all indications these journalists were harmed and terrorized, and I'm certainly in no position to judge them under those circumstances. I think that their comments upon being freed is fair game, and that they should be forthright about their forced conversion and renounce it (that is, if they do renounce it) not for our benefit, but for the terrorists' detriment.

[SlowBoat407]

As a muslim, Centanni now has the opportunity to speak on behalf of his people and denounce the violence done in the name of his new religion. (Thanks to Mrs. Slowboat for that suggestion)

[HitmanLV]

Very good observations! WOW! It's clear to me that the Muslim world doesn't see a lick of difference, in the end, between a forced conversion and a voluntary conversion.

Actually, I have come to understand (and this may be wrong) that at least some Muslims believe that we are all Muslim, just many of us don't know it yet. So turning to Islam is a 'reversion,' rather than a 'conversion.'

Now, that's a bit presumptuous, don't you think? Hahah!

[elcid1970]

Turns out you're right. Every human is a Muslim at birth, until led astray by his/her Jewish or Christian or Buddhist or Hindu parents.

`Reversion' is to Muslims the correct term for accepting Islam.

(raises .50 BMG rifle) "Hey, reversion this, Omar!!"

BLAM!