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To: r9etb
You're dancing, FRiend. Your term "adequate" implies that some sort of optimization is taking place -- you're saying that there is a threshold below which reproductive success becomes far less likely.

Incorrect. Reproductive success is a matter of a combination of physical traits relative to environmental conditions. There are multiple possible configurations for which success can occur, and what is successful in one environment may not be successful in another. Because there are multiple successful configurations and all such configurations are relatively successful based upon the environment, there is no defined "threshold".

Evolutionary changes are often described in terms of "improvements" which better adapt offspring to a given environment. Thus, your term "adequate" might be replaced by the more commonly used, "better adapted to the environment, and thus more likely to survive to pass on one's genes."

This still does not demonstrate the superiority of one race over another.

I've seen racial theories along the following lines: that humans evolved as they spread out of Africa; and that they were evolved higher intelligence in response to challenging environments that called for, say, greater cooperation or planning abilities. As a result, some have said that the "darker races," being less evolved, were inferior to the more intelligent races.

Does evidence exist to support the "greater intelligence" claim? If not, then it is purely conjecture? Also, what is meant by "greater intelligence"? Is this a measure of speed of acquistion of knowledge, ability to solve problems or is some other metric used?
214 posted on 08/28/2006 10:29:00 AM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Dimensio
Incorrect. Reproductive success is a matter of a combination of physical traits relative to environmental conditions.

A restatement of what I said to you. All you're saying is that "better" traits -- whether alone or in combination, lead to improved probability of reproductive success. Thus, "fitness" is still in the picture -- and your argument merely demonstrates your agreement with that claim.

Does evidence exist to support the "greater intelligence" claim? If not, then it is purely conjecture? Also, what is meant by "greater intelligence"? Is this a measure of speed of acquistion of knowledge, ability to solve problems or is some other metric used?

Empirically, one might point to the fact that sub-Saharan African countries tend to be (and have pretty much always been) savage sh*tholes, whereas non-African countries tend to be less so. One might also point to the positive correlation between IQ and income -- and note which races appear at the upper and lower points of each scale.

This still does not demonstrate the superiority of one race over another.

One could use the aforementioned observations to state that "racial superiority" has been demonstrated by empirical observation. (I don't hold to this conclusion --I'm merely showing that one can adduce the conclusion based on evidence.)

Getting back to the source of this, though, please note that we got onto this topic by your asking "How" the theory of evolution has been used to justify racist claims. The foregoing is one such example.

Another interesting example can be found in a couple of the Declarations of Secession, prior to the Civil War.

Mississippi's stated that:

These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization. That blow has been long aimed at the institution, and was at the point of reaching its consummation. There was no choice left us but submission to the mandates of abolition, or a dissolution of the Union, whose principles had been subverted to work out our ruin.

Texas stated that:

We hold as undeniable truths that the governments of the various States, and of the confederacy itself, were established exclusively by the white race, for themselves and their posterity; that the African race had no agency in their establishment; that they were rightfully held and regarded as an inferior and dependent race, and in that condition only could their existence in this country be rendered beneficial or tolerable.

There is, of course, a lot of additional context to these declarations; the thing I'm pointing out to you, however, is the very explicit statements of racial superiority, and the obvious "evolutionary basis" from which those claims are drawn.

237 posted on 08/28/2006 10:58:19 AM PDT by r9etb
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