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Mr. Silverstein:

There are a couple of very big red flags in your article. I hope you can follow them up with Michael Scheuer:

"In the long run, we're not safer because we're still operating on the assumption that we're hated because of our freedoms, when in fact we're hated because of our actions in the Islamic world."

No - We are hated because we are infidels and are not muslims. To a significant portion of the Islamic world, infidels are worthy of rape, slavery and slaughter. Even in the most "progressive" muslim countries in the world, non-muslims citizens are third class citizens. According to the Koran, it is right and good (and a way to heaven) to attack non-muslims and non-muslim lands. And once non-muslim land is conquered, it is forever muslim land (that is why Israeli really drives them nuts).

"If you're bin Laden living in a cave, all those things are part of the war and those things are going your way."

Somehow I do not think the invasion and conquering of two muslim countries by America, the death of nearly all his top leadership and himself living in cave worried that even one wrong cell phone call may invite Special Forces to pay him a visit was in his original plans. OBL wanted wars in which muslims would be killing and conquering the infidels. What he has now (mostly) is muslims killing muslims in muslim lands.

"It has said it couldn't get involved with large numbers in the Balkans war because it had no safe haven in the region."

This I do not understand. Thousands upon thousands of muslim fighters flocked to Bosnia and Kosovo from all across the middle east to fight the Serbs. They have a safe haven in Bosnia and Kosovo and are looking to expand them.

"We paid a great price for demonizing the Taliban. We saw them as evil because they didn't let women work, but that's largely irrelevant in Afghanistan."

The Taliban banned girls from school, executed women for adultery (from rape) as half time shows at soccer games, massacred untold tens of thousands (I have seen the mass graves), bombed cities to rubble, killed at will, destroyed anything non-islamic enough (including other mosques), wipe-out entire villages if one person converted from Islam, banned music, kite flying, certain haircuts, movies, etc. They were monsters. Yes, they kept order - so did the Nazis in the Jewish ghettos.

Regards,

2banana

1 posted on 08/23/2006 11:14:08 AM PDT by 2banana
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To: 2banana

A bigger load of shit I have yet to read.


2 posted on 08/23/2006 11:19:30 AM PDT by pissant
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To: 2banana
No - We are hated because we are infidels and are not muslims. This seems to be what the West is finally, hopefully becoming aware of. Good points.
3 posted on 08/23/2006 11:23:04 AM PDT by mikethevike (We could use a little global warming up here in MN)
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To: 2banana
inspired by the tangible and visible impact of our policies.

to paraphase ushad manji, "don't let them talk you into believing that it is the policies of the u.s. and britain that makes them behave this way."

iow, it is their policies, not ours, that are the problem.

4 posted on 08/23/2006 11:23:50 AM PDT by wildwood (remember steve centanni and olaf wiig)
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To: 2banana
"Michael Scheuer served in the CIA for 22 years before resigning in 2004; he served as the chief of the bin Laden unit at the Counterterrorist Center from 1996 to 1999."

Mr. Scheuer, considering you were in charge of preventing Bin Laden's Al-Qaeda from striking American interest, why did you fail so badly and put us in the position in which 9/11 took place?
10 posted on 08/23/2006 11:32:35 AM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: 2banana
No - We are hated because we are infidels and are not muslims.

That, plus the fact that we stand in the way of their ambitions.

11 posted on 08/23/2006 11:32:35 AM PDT by expatpat
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To: 2banana
No - We are hated because we are infidels and are not muslims.

That's true to a point, but it's not that simple.

We support a lot of tyrants in the name of stability, and that motivates people into nationalistic goals that are co-opted by Islam, the same way that many of the independence movements of the 20th century were co-opted by Communism. The hard core Islamic fundamentalists wouldn't have a fraction of the power they do now, if they weren't fed from one hand on hatred of their tyrant, and on the other from oil dollars.

Islamic whackjobs have always been a problem, but the reason that the 'global jihad' has legs has a lot more to do with local politics than theological intolerance.

13 posted on 08/23/2006 11:34:40 AM PDT by Steel Wolf (- Islam will never survive being laughed at. -)
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To: 2banana; All

Michael Scheuer was let out of the CIA by Portor Goss's predeccessor so that he could go blow smoke across the CIA failures of the 1990s,

and so he could go falsely blame our foreign policy instead of admitting just how little they, the CIA actually knew and understood about:

(1)Al Queda,
(2)its basis in radical Islamic fundamentalist philosophy - not reactions to U.S. policy -
and
(3) just how deep the radical philosophy was penetrating Islamic societies and creating public push in those societies for changes in the policies of Islamic nations, to fulfill the goals of the radical philosophy - movement toward a world Islamic caliphate.

The CIA failed in the 1990s and continues to fail because it is more ignorant about the philosophical movement - and the depth and breadth of that movement - that underpins the terrorists than most western high school kids were about communism in the 1960s.

We lost nothing when people like Schuerer were let out of the CIA so they could author misinformation that blames the policians for the CIAs failures.


17 posted on 08/23/2006 11:37:55 AM PDT by Wuli
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To: 2banana

Michael Scheurer is NOT an expert in this at all...he was wrong starting with the answer to the first question.


21 posted on 08/23/2006 11:47:27 AM PDT by Txsleuth (((((((((ISRAEL))))))) Prayers up for Steve, Olaf, and the Israeli kidnapped soldiers.)
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To: 2banana
I met him for breakfast last week at an IHOP in the Virginia suburbs outside of Washington. Over a plate of eggs and hash browns, he answered a series of questions about the current state of the Bush Administration’s “War on Terrorism.” His prognosis was illuminating and insightful—and, unfortunately, almost unrelentingly grim

They met at an IHOP?

I envision two men wearing dark suits speaking in low conspiratorial tones in the orange plastic confines of the booth.."uh, excuse me Mike..but I think you've got a bit of egg on your face..."

29 posted on 08/23/2006 12:23:15 PM PDT by Mad Dash
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To: 2banana
Hard to imagine this level of delusion. We are hated because 'of what we do' - you mean, not letting the islamofascists kill all of the Jews? You mean that part?

The whole palestinian thing is a total cannard. Its a fundraising tool. The jihadists and the arab media point to the poor abused palestinians all the freakin time while failing to point out that of the 4 countries who have been to war with the 'palestinians' in the last 40 years only one of them was Israel.

I really love the whole 'we are only antagonizing them by fighting them' approach. I guess the best thing we could do would just be build a big freaking wall around our coasts, hiring 200,000 union members to hand-sort the contents of every container, resign from the UN/NATO/WTO/CFR/UNICEF/ and, oh yeah, kill all of the Jews!!!! Yeah, that would really make them love us and forgot that they are a pathetically delinquent society 700 years behind the West with ugly women, uglier men, no freedom, no pursuit of happiness and no skills beyond beheadings foreigners or beating their wives.

I'm sure that the US trying to keep Iran from going nuclear is also going to really piss off the jihadist so we better stop doing that as well. And I'm sure that when we helped the muslims in Afghanistan in the 80s & in Sarajevo, Bosnia & Kuwait in the 90s that was also causing the 'arab street' to hate us for 'what we do'. Gosh, we really have a lot to make up for.

Maybe this genius has an idea why it is that the muslim world seems not to just hate the U.S. but every other country in the world??? They are at war with the Russians in Chechnya, India, Israel, Sudan, Sri Lanka, etc. etc. Are the Sudanese people somehow doing something wrong to antagonize these jihadists and get themselves beheaded? Very confusing to follow the logic.

31 posted on 08/23/2006 12:33:40 PM PDT by bpjam (Hezbollah, Hamas, Al Qaida - The Religion of Peace)
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To: 2banana
Somehow I do not think the invasion and conquering of two muslim countries by America, the death of nearly all his top leadership and himself living in cave worried that even one wrong cell phone call may invite Special Forces to pay him a visit was in his original plans.

Those two countries are jihad magnets and recruiting tools that pull in more terrorists every day. His top leadership, when taken out one by one, is replacable, since we never get large numbers of them at any time. From the looks of the stage he sent his last video from, if it's a cave he's living in it's a roomy, high end model. Finally, given how long he's been attacking America, he's probably surprised to be alive at all in mid 2006.

OBL wanted wars in which muslims would be killing and conquering the infidels. What he has now (mostly) is muslims killing muslims in muslim lands.

What he wanted specifically was for all true Muslims to rise up and fight apostate Muslims and infidels. Since he considers all of the dying Muslims to be either apostates or martyrs, and that his global jihadist movement is growing every year, while we're bogged down in Iraq, things aren't going quite as bad for his whackjob sceme as you'd think.

35 posted on 08/23/2006 12:46:55 PM PDT by Steel Wolf (- Islam will never survive being laughed at. -)
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To: 2banana; basalt; cinives; ClaireSolt; Lee'sGhost; Bryan24; tobyhill; bpjam; Mad Dash; RC51; ...
A REPLY:

-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Silverstein
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 5:15 PM
To: 2banana
Subject: Re: Six Questions for Michael Scheuer on National Security

thanks for note. interesting points, not sure i agree with all of them, but will run some of it by scheuer. best, ken





AND MY REPLY:

Ken,

Thanks for the response.

Of course, the biggest questions of them all -

"Michael Scheuer served in the CIA for 22 years before resigning in 2004; he served as the chief of the bin Laden unit at the Counterterrorist Center from 1996 to 1999."

1. Why did the effort fail so badly to prevent Bin Laden's Al-Qaeda from striking American interests, and how did we get put in the position in which 9/11 took place?

2. Why did the administration do nothing when the Sudanese government offered to arrest and deport OBL to America several times from 1996-1997?*

3. Why was there such an intelligence failure, year-after-year, for the following attacks directed by Bin Laden's Al-Qaeda against America:

1993 First World Trade Center bombing, 7 Killed, Hundreds injured
1996 Khobar Towers bombing, 19 American Servicemen murdered
1998 U.S. Kenya Embassy blown up, 100's murdered
1998 U.S. Tanzania Embassy blown up, 100's murdered 2000 USS Cole attacked, 17 U.S. Navy sailors murdered

I know this was a friendly meeting at IHOP talking about grandiose topics - but the information and details which Michael Scheuer knows intimately would have made for some good answers.

Regards,

2banana

* As pointed out by another veteran CIA colleague (Robert Baer) in the NYT's best seller "See No Evil"
45 posted on 08/24/2006 6:25:03 AM PDT by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - They want to die for Islam, and we want to kill them.)
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