30 Tanks Wiped Out in Lebanon

ISRAEL NATIONAL NEWS ^ | Aug 11, '06 | not attributed

[APRPEH]

(IsraelNN.com) IDF officials admit that the biggest surprise of the ongoing war against Hizbullah is the ease by which terrorists have destroyed IDF tanks.

At least 30 tanks have been totally destroyed or seriously damaged in bomb and anti-tank rocket attacks involving state-of-the-art Russian anti-tank rockets.

About one-half of the military personnel killed in southern Lebanon were inside tanks.

[DogBarkTree]

Put a hold on the tanks. Use these for a while and then send in the tanks. Someday we will start fighting this war the way it needs to be fought.

[CPT Clay]

Thanks Russia

[APRPEH]

Nice Merkava Backgrounder

[aegiscg47]

The Merkava was built to deal with the Syrian, Egyptian, and Iraqi T-72s and possible T-80s, so it was fine for the 1990's, but it has stagnated. Also, probes and raids with tanks isn't the most efficient use of armor, leading to the enemy being able to pick off vehicles at will. Armor needs to be used in full scale assaults, backed by artillery and air support so that enemy forces don't have a chance to get set up for a attack with AT missiles.

Also, it looks like the Hezbos got some of the new top attack AT missiles from Russia(via Iran and Syria) or they have modified their tactics to attack the Merkava at it's weak points. The M1A2 has better ceramic armor, fire suppression, and armor on the top that would defeat most of these types of attacks.

[DB]

Our M1A2's were taken out in Iraq from what I believe are the same weapons. We had fewer casualties as a result but the tanks were destroyed nevertheless.

[DCPatriot]

Wow. It's hard to get a feel on the size of that thing. The SUV off to the side may be farther away than it appears if a long lens was used in taking the photo.

[Bombard]

I am not sure how the IDF is fighting the ground war. Sending tanks in the lead with limited infantry support against a dug in enemy with modern ATGM's will result in high losses. I still respect the IDF but I question their tactical and operational decisions during the present operations in Lebanon.

[GarySpFc]

How does this work? The Russians sell them to Syria, who hands them over to Hezbollah?

The Russians sold Syria a batch of the RPG-29 in the later ninties. The advanced RPG-29S which is hitting the Israeli tanks has only been sold to China and India, not Syria or Iran. It appears China or India has sold some on the black market, and I think we have a good idea which of the two have done this.

[massadvj]

If Israel accepts a diplomatic solution that leaves the Hezzies with any significant military capability, it is game, set, match on the WOT. Israel will be off the map within a decade and our children and grandchildren will endure unimaginable restrictions on their liberties. Most Middle East regimes will fall to Muslim extremists, including Pakistan.

If we think the appeasement strategy is misguided, wait until we see the post-appeasement strategy, which will involve paying off blackmailers who can hurl nuclear bombs and issue passports.

[Raycpa]

Proving Rumsfeld was right.

[Lazamataz]

Our M1A2's were taken out in Iraq from what I believe are the same weapons. We had fewer casualties as a result but the tanks were destroyed nevertheless.

Then it is time to upgrade to this:

[massadvj]

How does this work? The Russians sell them to Syria, who hands them over to Hezbollah?

No one hands over anything. Everything is purchased. Iran is doing the purchasing, using money we westerners spend on $3 gasoline. In their minds they are using our own decadence to kill us. And it appears to be working.

[APRPEH]

wait until we see the post-appeasement strategy, which will involve paying off blackmailers who can hurl nuclear bombs and issue passports.

back to Barbary?

[GarySpFc]

Assume it doesn't have reactive armor?

The Merkva tank does have reactive armor. The Israelis were the ones discovered it and the first to use it on their tanks. The problem they are having is the RPG-29S has a tandem warhead. The first one disables the reactive armor, and the second is a shaped charge, which destroys the tanks. Apparently China has sold the RPG-29S to Iran or Syria, who have in turn given it to Hizbollah.

[Bombard]

Most if not all on the M-1's taken out in Iraq have lost to roadside bombs. I remember one event early on where a new Russian hit a Abrams and did damage but did not destroy the tank. Again I think the IDF tank losses reflect tactical mistakes by the Israelis.

[Inge_CAV]

Donate the Israelis some Warthogs to defend their tanks. Hell, give them B-52's to carpetbomb the Hissies.

[Types_with_Fist]

back to Barbary?

It's not as if the culture has progressed past that point.

[stylin19a]

In the all-out battles of the 1991 Gulf War, only 18 Abrams tanks were lost and no soldiers in them killed.

But since the March 2003 invasion of Iraq, with tanks in daily combat against the unexpectedly fierce insurgency, the Army says 80 of the 69-ton behemoths have been damaged so badly they had to be shipped back to the United States.

No stinking perspective. 1991 gulf war ground war lasted what ? 4 days ?

[Tallguy]

Thank you. I've been saying the same thing on other threads. There is nothing wrong with the Merk other than the way it is being used -- as an assault gun. It wouldn't matter if they were using M1A2's except that perhaps more of the crews would survive (which isn't trivial).

[GarySpFc]

Iran obtained and reverse-engineered our TOW missiles from Iran-Contra, and that might be part of the problem.