Replies

It's difficult to predict the results of a battleship-battleship duel: There are surprisely few actual big-gun battles to compare results, despite the millions an millions spent on battleship and battlecruiser construction since the end of the 1898 Spanish-American War and the Japanses-Russian War.

Some fights are very conclusive:

Battlecruiser-battleships. Battlecruiser results are pretty conclusive: they sink. Quickly. Blow up good! (When hit by even only one or two rounds of a "real" gun. Few, if any, survivors after the magazines explode.) So battlecruisers are good for "fleet pride" and "showing the flag" as long as they NEVER go against real battleships.

Battleship-Aircraft, or Battlecruiser-Aircraft. (in-port)No contest. Aircraft win. Every time. Pearl Harbor. Tirpitz. Italian Navy. Japanese Navy. German Navy. Etc., etc. Only ones who survived were the Brit fleet anchored in Scotland - which makes you wonder why the Germans didn't try to bomb them.

Battleship-Aircraft, or Battlecruiser-Aircraft. (At-sea) Edge goes to aircraft. By far. Few battleships survived, those that did usually evaded (clouds or nightfall in pre-radar days are pretty effective) rather than actually defeated the aircraft. Aircraft carrier-aircraft were less successful, probably because the carriers were faster, easier to turn away from the level bombers and torpedo planes. Battleships were slower, less maneuverable. And, of course, as the war in the pacific progresses, the enemy attacked more aircraft carriers rather than battleships BECAUSE the aircraft were more dangerous. Also, there were more aircraft carriers.

battleship-Ground Fort:

For all the millions spent there, the only hit I know of was Battleship Texas getting a hole from the German big guns off Normandy during D-Day. So, is it worth it building forts, if they aren't used? Or is it worth the money building expensive anti-ship fortresses and defenses SINCE that means they won't be used? (Because that means the enemy (the naval targets) have stayed away from your ports and cities....)

So, battleship-battleship? Didn't happen often, other than Leyte Gulf where US firepower slaughtered the Japanese by crossing the tee. (Aided by side-shooting torpedoes from smaller ambusher from the side.)

Single-ship actions?

WWI had few battleship actions - most of the time they stayed locked up, almost as if the opposing admirals were afraid of using them. Not too many battleship hits even in the big fleet action off Jutland. Battlecruiser squadron actions actions were more common. And, as usual, the battlecruisers sunk.

WWII: Well over a 1000 shell hits took out the Bismark, but she was still afloat when the Brit fleet left the area. And, of course, many of those hits were smaller calibre hits from the surrounding Brit ships coming up after the aircraft knocked out Bismark's steering. But 2 Brit battleships (one very new, one very old) were needed before the smaller ships could come up close. Earlier, Bismark destroyed the Hood (BC) and had some damage (oil slick) from another battleship: Again, same thumb rule: To sink any bigger battleship at sea: attack it with two or more smaller ships. Plate River (south America): 3 British cruisers took out a larger German ship.

Guadalcanal: Hiei got knocked out by US cruisers at night, but stayed afloat and only later was sunk by aircraft the next day.

A few nights later, Kirishima, a survivor of the battle with Hiei, was sunk by USS Washington in a night gun action.

No Med battleship-battleship other than the Brit's taking out the French fleet when it was anchored in Africa happened that I know of. Italian fleet pretty much stayed in port after getting hit by British air. (That's where Yamamoto learned how to attack battleships with torpedoes in shallow water.)

As always, check my assumptions!

You're speaking of the Graf Spee, of course, and the HMS Exeter, HMS Ajax and HMNZS Achilles?

The Graf Spee, with 11" guns, took out the Exeter who had only 8" guns. Didn't sink the Exeter, but she was ordered back to the Falklands, heavily damaged. The Ajax & Achilles, with 6" guns, did little damage to the Graf Spee.

The Graf Spee took refuge in the Plate Estuary, and there remains some question as to why he did so, since the ship wasn't that heavily damaged. She then returned to sea where the Captain scuttled his ship.

...Plate River (south America): 3 British cruisers took out a larger German ship.

Minor quibble: To sink any bigger battleship at sea: attack it with two or more smaller ships. Plate River (south America): 3 British cruisers took out a larger German ship.

German "pocket-battleships" like the Graf Spee were not REAL battleships. The Germans called them "Panzerschiff". It was British propaganda that coined the term "Pocket Battleship" to give the idea that they were something that they were not. Those ships had almost no armor, and only 11-inch guns. Plus they lacked the steam turbine powerplant of a true dreadnought having diesel engines instead (ie. they weren't that fast compared to a battleship).

So they were under-gunned, unarmored, and too slow. Meat on the table for a couple of heavy-cruisers -- which is how it turned out. Oh, the one thing that they did have was enormous RANGE owing to the efficiency of the diesels. One wonders why they went to the expense of 11-inch armament on ships that could only be used for commerce raiding. Fleet actions were out of the question.

So, battleship-battleship? Didn't happen often, other than Leyte Gulf where US firepower slaughtered the Japanese by crossing the tee. (Aided by side-shooting torpedoes from smaller ambusher from the side.)

December 26, 1943-The Scharnhorst is sighted by the British battleship Duke of York, and is sunk by the British ship at roughly 7:45 p.m., after several hours of fighting. Of the entire crew, only 36 of the Scharnhorst’s crew would survive.

Of course, I would add the following engagements:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Port_Arthur Battle of Port Arthur at the start of the Russo-Japanese War. Although tactically inconclusive, the Russian Pacific fleet was bottled in the harbor, where it later succumbed to Japanese naval and land artillary attack.
In the Battle of Tsushima, the Russian Baltic fleet was all but destroyed. The Russians lost 7 Battleships, with only one surviving!

And then there was that little incident of Denmark during World War I, called the Battle of Jutland.

The British Battlecruiser HMS Lion was hit thrice by 11-inch shells and survived. The SMS Seydlitz likewise survived a number of hits, including 15 inch shells. The SMS Derfflinger was hit 21 times at Jutland .Fortunately, for her crew, the Germans armored their ships better than the Brits, and the British shells were poor penetrators.