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To: RSteyn
RSteyn said: "Just because an electrical engineer in Singapore or Japan or Malaysia makes the equivalent of $65k there does not mean they will make that here if there are no openings for them. "

What possible motivation would the remaining companies have for moving engineering jobs to Singapore or Japan if the cost here is the same as there?

Jobs are leaving because there is economic advantage to moving them. When that advantage disappears then the jobs will stop moving.

You make it sound like Americans are so stupid that we are all going to stand around whining while our families starve to death. Tell me something. How much less than you are spending now could your family live on? I'm talking just the basics. Food, shelter, simple clothing, medical attention only for serious matters, etc.

Those with the biggest problem will be those with huge debts. Such debts will be very painful for those who overestimate their future prospects. The "things" that some people have accumulated will become much less valuable if there is a serious downturn.

The changes I am describing are going to take place over a couple of generations, not overnight. There will be some fluctuations that will give warning to those paying attention.

Consider what is happening to GM. They are downsizing what, about 25% due to loss of market share? Does that mean that people aren't buying cars anymore? No. It means that they are buying cars from other companies. Just as soon as GM begins making the same car at the same price as those companies, they can expect to have their business stop shrinking.

I have no idea just how small GM, or any other auto maker will have to become before the employees DEMAND that their wages be reduced. But there will be millions of workers who take jobs at wages that are low enough to justify their employment. Let's just pray that the government doesn't try to help with a minimum wage law. Or limits on maximum hours like in France.

I'll ask you again. What do you think will be happening over the next two generations? What do you think will happen to the standard of living? What will happen to government spending? What will happen to the Social Insecurity system?

420 posted on 06/26/2006 5:55:46 PM PDT by William Tell (RKBA for California (rkba.members.sonic.net) - Volunteer by contacting Dave at rkba@sonic.net)
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To: William Tell

>Tell me something. How much less than you are spending now could your family live on? I'm talking just the basics. Food, shelter, simple clothing, medical attention only for serious matters, etc. <

Not much less. I live on ramen noodles and tunafish sandwiches. My clothes are all several years old. I do without dental. My prescriptions are what I can get free from my doctor as samples. The house is paid for. I owe $3200 on a car & have no other debts. This is not high living.

>Jobs are leaving because there is economic advantage to moving them. When that advantage disappears then the jobs will stop moving. <

It's nowhere near that simple. People are not little plastic parts, instantly interchangeable no matter where they are used if the molds are the same. If you do not have the kind of educational system in place to produce highly skilled workers, if you do not have industries in place to hire those workers and further hone those skills, the talent pool won't be there.

If you could hire a chemical engineer for $5k a year, would you do it if the only computer experience he had was with punch card mainframes and he never held a calculator in his life? He wouldn't be much of a bargain; you'd spend years bringing the guy up to speed no matter how intelligent, dedicated, and flexible he was-or how cheaply he would work.


422 posted on 06/26/2006 6:10:19 PM PDT by RSteyn
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To: William Tell
What possible motivation would the remaining companies have for moving engineering jobs to Singapore or Japan if the cost here is the same as there?

Actually, some manufacturing of items that are costly to ship is moving back. I think we could compete if we set our mind to it.

The key would be to cut needless regulation and bureacracy. Nobody wants to live in a cesspool. We need some safety and environmental regulation to prevent another "Love Canal." Yet I have to keep a syringe & needle inventory in the lab when any addict can go to a free clinic and get a free one. Why hasn't the legislature removed this waste? In NY we have school boards, towns, cities, counties, and the state - all with bureacracy and taxing ability. We need no more than state and county government. When growing up I lived through "consolidation" of the Duval County and city of Jacksonville Fla governments. The savings were substantial and there was no loss in quality of essential services. We need to eliminate waste and stop subsidizing able-bodied, unproductive people. The "wolf at the door" is a powerful motivator.

To summarize, the solution is to cut the waste and get competitive.

423 posted on 06/26/2006 6:11:09 PM PDT by RochesterFan
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