Posted on 05/23/2006 1:58:25 PM PDT by NYer
I would suggest that they stop calling themselves Christians if that is what they believe. Especially that part about Jesus sinning! Where the heck do people come up with this stuff? Have they gone mad?
I have to agree with you about those who think Jesus sinned! I have never heard any such thing.
It's shocking what people will say and do these days. There doesn't seem to be much respect for God or a respectful fear of Him anymore in some individuals.
"My question remains unanswered why are so many here obsessed and so hateful?"
It was answered many times over but you don't want to acknowledge the truth you've been told.
No one is obsessed or hateful. Only your thoughts to that effect remain obsessed and hateful.
What you believe, and what is are two seperate matters.. you are free to believe whatever you want... but when what you believe clearly is at conflict with the writings of the faith, then what you believe is NOT what is.
"God is love" is nothing more than feel goodism, its not religion and its not theology. The teachings and words of Christ routinely blow holes in this childish notion.. and only one utterly ignorant of the Bible, both old and new testaments can grab onto such a sound bite.
There are some that aren't utterly ignorant of the Bible, but they choose to ignore the teachings they don't like.
I know what you mean about that feel goodism religion. There are a lot of people today being poisoned by that modernist claptrap.
In other words, you reject historic Christian doctrine. So why are you wasting our time? Just admit that you're not a Christian, quit worrying about what Christendom says or does, and go on your gay and merry way.
Be warned, however: that road leads to a very unpleasant destination. Is homosexuality *that* important to you, that you're willing to go to hell for it?
Yes. The Bible commands that unrepentant sinners be expelled from the church. Clinton would qualify, if the churches he attended still bothered with the Bible.
But I wonder why such intense feelings for homosexuals?
There isn't an "Adultery Pride" movement or a "Drug Addict" pride movement...
There isn't a conspiracy in the schools to promote adultery and drug addiction (except, perhaps, Ritalin) as "alternative lifestyles"...
There isn't a plot in the halls of governments around the world to force churches to stop preaching against adultery or drug addiction...
No pastors in Sweden or Canada have been arrested and jailed for preaching against drug addiction or adultery...
And nobody has the UNMITIGATED GALL to tell the Judeo-Christian religions to abandon millenia-old teachings that prohibit drug addiction or adultery...
But homosexuality is guilty of all this and much, much more. This is why homosexuality, at this particular point in history, receives (and DESERVES) much more intense hostility.
Yes, sometimes it does. Should probably happen more often to be truly biblically based.
If that were true I might as well burn in hell because I would not want to spend eternity with that kind of God. For me, God *must* be far more loving, kind, good, wise, generous, splendid, magnificent, responsible, safe, caring, knowing, wonderful, virtuous, beautiful, marvelous, powerful, intelligent etc etc than I can even imagine or conceive. And these are but words symbols of symbols that but give a hint or a clue as to the meaning. All of these are parts of what Love is (where the Whole is greater than the sum of the parts)... for Love is not some tiny thing that a man might define it as. Love is not sometimes kind and sometimes unkind or sometimes helpful and sometimes hurtful. Love is beyond what can be taught or written about. It contains no fear or anger or cruelty or condemnation. To think these things is not to understand love. So many people think they can just redefine words to suit themselves and in their smallness and egotism they think that Love is pain or part of Love is hate. Hate is not love and love is not hate. Perfect Love casts out fear and that means that there is no fear in Love or any of the constricting emotions that fear spawns.
So, you are welcome to your beliefs. I dont see how you could settle for so little but, it is your choice and you are responsible for it.
Sunsong, I think God has all the attributes you mentioned, but I feel you are doing something that is very common today. God made us in HIS image, we don't make Him in OUR image. We conform to Him, He doesn't conform to us.
I'm sure there are lots of us here that would rather have some thing in Scripture not be a sin so that we can get away with doing behaviors that would land us in hell. Do you think Christians get a kick out of the fact that there is a hell? No, but we believe what the Lord Jesus Christ told us and Sunsong, He said there is a hell and we will go to it if we don't obey Him.
Jesus actually preached more warnings about hell than He did about getting into Heaven. This isn't something Christians made up to scare you into doing right..it comes straight from the Lord.
Sunsong,
My arguments have nothing to do with one Church over another, it has to simply do with the Bible, which is the foundation if one is honest for all Judeao/Christian teaching, regardless of which denomination or "church" one belongs to.
People who whitewash this information into "God is Love" are fooling themselves.
It is absolutely true God loves all his children, however to take that fact and twist into the soundbite "God is Love" is completely incorrect, if your faith is in any way shape or form based upon the Scriptures.
The "God is Love" foolishness is generally espoused by persons and groups who wish to, for whatever reason, live in direct violation and unapologetically in defiance of the Scriptures to make themselves feel better and to justify in their own minds that its ok.. even though they live in direct violation of the word of God, and do so openly and unappologetically because "He is Love".
You will not dictate to God what he has declared a sin is not one.
You seem to be of the mind that punishing someone or not allowing them what they want is inately an act of hate. The punishment of hell is not that Satan will torture our souls for all eternity, but that those destined there will never be in the grace of their creator, not because God is evil or wicked or even hateful.. but because one willfully and knowingly defied God's commandments and laws have not earned the right to be there.
I know it may make you feel better trying to say those of different faiths are just closed minded... I don't believe those who go to different churches than I will be denied the grace of heaven... in fact I believe those who have never even heard the name of Christ may well reach heaven.. However those that have been exposed and have access to Gods teachings, and willfully and unapologetically live in defiance of them, no matter what church they belong to and believe "God is Love" so its ok... are not going to reach heaven. Not because they belong to a different church than I do, but because they willfully place their own will above Gods word, and expect God will yeild to them.
All perfectly true. None of it changes the fact that God also hates homosexuality.
In fact, He hates it precisely because His love for humanity is so great that He does not want individuals or civilizations to be caught up in any soul destroying addictions, homosexuality included.
1 Beloved, don't believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit who confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God,
3 and every spirit who doesn't confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God, and this is the spirit of the Antichrist, of whom you have heard that it comes. Now it is in the world already.
4 You are of God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is he who is in you than he who is in the world.
5 They are of the world. Therefore they speak of the world, and the world hears them. John's Third Letter
6 We are of God. He who knows God listens to us. He who is not of God doesn't listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is of God; and everyone who loves is born of God, and knows God.
8 He who doesn't love doesn't know God, for God is love.
9 By this God's love was revealed in us, that God has sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.
10 In this is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son as the atoning sacrifice for our sins.
11 Beloved, if God loved us in this way, we also ought to love one another.
12 No one has seen God at any time. If we love one another, God remains in us, and his love has been perfected in us.
13 By this we know that we remain in him and he in us, because he has given us of his Spirit.
14 We have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son as the Savior of the world.
15 Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God remains in him, and he in God.
16 We know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and he who remains in love remains in God, and God remains in him.
17 In this love has been made perfect among us, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment, because as he is, even so are we in this world.
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear has punishment. He who fears is not made perfect in love.
19 We love him, because he first loved us.
20 If a man says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who doesn't love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? The Letter from Jude
21 This commandment we have from him, that he who loves God should also love his brother.
Yawn. Do they really think they are impressing anyone anymore?
1 Corinthians
Chapter 13
1 If I speak in human and angelic tongues but do not have love, I am a resounding gong or a clashing cymbal.
2 And if I have the gift of prophecy and comprehend all mysteries and all knowledge; if I have all faith so as to move mountains but do not have love, I am nothing.
3 If I give away everything I own, and if I hand my body over so that I may boast but do not have love, I gain nothing.
4 Love is patient, love is kind. It is not jealous, (love) is not pompous, it is not inflated,
5 it is not rude, it does not seek its own interests, it is not quick-tempered, it does not brood over injury,
6 it does not rejoice over wrongdoing but rejoices with the truth.
7 It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8 Love never fails. If there are prophecies, they will be brought to nothing; if tongues, they will cease; if knowledge, it will be brought to nothing.
9 For we know partially and we prophesy partially,
10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will pass away.
11 When I was a child, I used to talk as a child, think as a child, reason as a child; when I became a man, I put aside childish things.
12 At present we see indistinctly, as in a mirror, but then face to face. At present I know partially; then I shall know fully, as I am fully known.
13 So faith, hope, love remain, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
And exactly how does 1 John 4 excuse homosexual conduct?
Did you read it? Do you agree with it?
I know it like the back of my hand. All of the Bible. I don't say that to be arrogant, but I spend a great deal of time reading Sacred Scripture. Yes, I agree with it. You still haven't answered my question though.
How do the references you gave from Scripture excuse homosexual conduct which the Bible condemns? Let's use some context here, okay? You can't pick and choose out of Scripture only the passages that you like best and try to use them to say homosexual conduct is biblically permissable. It isn't!
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