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To: doc30

http://hytechapps.com/index.html

Check the scientific paper that goes with this. The guy who wrote it can only postulate on what's happening, and yes, there are a lot of GCMS charts included.

I cannot help but wonder if it's not related to something on another weird site:

http://www.blacklightpower.com/

Truth outs. So all we really have to do is pop popcorn and enjoy the show.


176 posted on 05/23/2006 2:17:50 PM PDT by Gulf War One
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To: Gulf War One; Ichneumon; PatrickHenry; floridaobserver
I looked at that so-called paper and it is meaningless gibberish. Ichneumon, in post 132, did a good job of showing the scientific idiocy of this nonsensical text. To back up what he wrote, I'll describe the bogus spectra he shows.

THe author claims to show the infrared spectra of H2, O2 and his magical HHO gases. Infrared spectroscopy involves the absorption of infrared light by a molecule. The frequency of the light involved needs to match a transition state in the molcule for absorption to occurr. For molecules, infrared energy corresponds to vibrational energy. Single atoms don't have vibrational modes so infrared doesn't apply to them. But there is another requirement. The molecular vibration must have a transition dipole moment. In other words, the molecular vibration, in its simplest terms, can be represented by a stretching vibration between to atoms in the molecule. It's like two balls connected by a spring. If the frequency of the light matches the frequency of the stretching oscillation, then the light can be absorbed.

There is another requirement, however. There must be a charge difference between the two atoms. This is called a dipole. If there is no dipole, no charge difference between the atoms, there is no vibrational absorption. There are more rules than this, but it would be too much to get into symmetry arguments here. Carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide each have strong transition dipole moments so they are very good at absorbing infrared light. And that is the origin on CO2 being a 'greenhouse' gas. But oxygen and hydrogen gases, O2 and H2, do not have transition dipole moments so they do not absorb infrared light at all. It doesn't happen. They are also highly symmetric molecules and highly symmetric vibrations in highly symmetric nonpolar molecules have vibrational modes that are infrared inactive. They may be Raman active (another type of vibrational spectroscopy which is complimentary to infrared) but it has polarizability rules regarding observation of vibrational bands. I've seen nitrogen in Raman spectroscopy, but I don't know about O2 or H2. I do vibrational spectroscopy for a living and those two gases are undetectable by the infrared technique.

Also, since O2 and H2 are diatomic, these molecules can only have 1 vibrational mode. That's a simple stretching vibration. Each molecule would, in theory, have only 1 vibrational peak in the spectrum. The spectra shown in the paper have multiple bands. Therefore, they are not what he claims. They are a lie. Period. Secondly, no baseline is visible in the graphs. Whatever spectrum is shown, it is shifted above the 100%T line and we are only seeing the tips of the peaks in the graphs. This is a very, very deceptive way of showing spectra. Also, the spectra look like manipulated spectra of some organics species.

Threfore, I can state with authority that the spectra shown in that unpublished 'scientific' paper are bogus. Not a single chart is representative of anything meaningful. I do this type of work for a living and I would be fired if I produced data like that. It's an embarassment to spectroscopists everywhere.

I also went back to the website and but the paper doesn't seem available anymore. I wanted to see what lab did this work. The name didn't sound familiar to me and I know most of the places local to this guy. I'm in the same county. Someone should ask him for an MSDS, if the material is available, and see what it says. That should also be worth a few laughs.

197 posted on 05/24/2006 6:34:30 AM PDT by doc30 (Democrats are to morals what and Etch-A-Sketch is to Art.)
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