Posted on 05/21/2006 6:39:23 PM PDT by MinorityRepublican
The Serbs once believed this "commonality" too, which is why they helped form "Yugoslavia", instead of the geographical "Greater Serbia" they could have literally gotten post-WWI. And look what happened to them!
But as I wrote before, you will be strongly punished for this lack of common sense. Your voice in Europe wont be heard and your small national interest wont be taken seriously into consideration of the larger states. Could you deny this? I’m asking seriously.
Balkaners ARE already punished by the larger countries when the larger countries see fit, and for ANY reason the larger countries see fit, now. Balkaners are a disfunctional family of peoples because they have been played off of one another by outside powers so many times that they hate each others guts. They get torn apart and shoved back together in "countries" by the whims of the Great counties whenever the power shifts between those Great Countries.
My father said it and he is right -- the Balkans are the geopolitical fault line of Europe.
When Germany is strong & Russia is weak, the Serbs get screwed -- and the Catholic Croats and Slovenes are Golden.
When Russia & Greece are strong, the Croats and Slovenes are the whipping boys, and the Serbs are Golden.
When the Muslim world is strong, the Bosnian Muslims (and now the Albanians) are on top, Serbs are screwed and the Croats & Slovenes are protected by the West.
If you notice --in two out three of these scenarios, the Serbs get screwed.
Yugoslavia was built on the false idea of communism and hypocrisy. It is not a good base to build a successful country. The Serbs are not even a bit less responsible for what happened than the rest of the “Yugoslavs”. Idiot Milosevic had a great support among the population.
Another thing that amaze me in Balkans. How could you seriously believe that Russia or Germany support anybody over there? Catholics or Orthodox? What a joke, these countries never cared about religion, imperialism was always on their agenda. THERE IS NO RELIGION IN POLICY!!! They give a damn about Balkans, that is why they watched with pleasure how you destroyed Yugoslavia. But you prefer to listen countries that tell you to fight each other and sold their weapons to you…
Questions arise, when the Balkaners start to care about their own interest and don’t look on Russia, Germany, US or EU? (here I should notice that war definitely is not in your interest). As long as you will follow foreign interests you are doomed.
Once Yugoslavia was the most important country in Balkans and now this region of Europe is an ideal place to NOT visit for important politicians. Solution is in unity but unity cannot be forced, common sense in necessary on all interested sides. Of course you can always be pushovers if this position fits you well...
This is the saddest news since Chad got his own country, and he and Jeremy never made another album.
Sorry, Lukasz. Yugolavia was no more "built on..communism" than Poland was!
Yugoslavia was brought into being post-WWI, after the Serbs won the WWI. The Croats & Slovenes had been on the Austro-Hungarian side and lost. However, shortly after Yugoslavia's inception, facism was on the rise and the Croats & Slovenes chose fascism -- and the Croats had Yugoslav King Alexander assasinated in Marseilles in the early 30's. The day Hitler's forces finally marched into Croatia, most Croats were throwing flowers in the streets and any Croats & Slovenes who opposed the Ustashi were killed or thrown in prison.
After King Alexander was assasinated, but before Nazi Germany took over, Prince Paul became Regent of Yugoslavia. Prince Paul had been educated at Oxford and his outlook was almost entirely British; he was also related to the Bristish royals. Prince Paul did everything to appeal to the Croats and Slovenes to stay together -- and everything to get Britain to help him and his little country, but they turned their backs on him and ignored him. Eventually Churchill sold out Yugoslavia to the communists to satisfy Stalin's ambitions.
Another thing that amaze me in Balkans. How could you seriously believe that Russia or Germany support anybody over there? Catholics or Orthodox?
"Religion", whether people believe it or not, whether people acknowledge it or not, plays an indirect but not insubstantial role in making policy everywhere. Religions build cultures, cultures build countries, countries make policy. None of us is immune to the culture in which we were raised;we are all influenced by it.
Religion has always played an especially large part in Yugoslavia, which is why Tito tried to wipe it out. Until the Euro immigration policies of the last 30 years, Yugoslavia was as far North and West as Islam went, as far South and East as Catholicism went, as far West as Eastern Orthodoxy went, in any significant historical numbers.
You are right about imperialists, but imperialists need "proxies" within a country to make their policies look legitimate. Who better to serve as a proxy than people with whom you share a religious faith? The ones who seem most "like you"? Do you know who the first country was to recognize Croatian and Slovene independence? (The Vatican -- Germany was second!)
As long as you will follow foreign interests you are doomed.
What choice is there? Follow your own interests and you get bombed, sanctioned and isolated. No small country can exist on its own.
The Serbs are not even a bit less responsible for what happened than the rest of the “Yugoslavs”.
Look, "the Serbs" ,"the Moslems", "the Croats" have all been assigned repsonsibility for their actions. However, they did not do what they did "in a complete vacuum". The media, the OSCE, the EU, Germany, Iran, Russia, the US, NATO and a host of NGO's (most notably George Soros' clones) have had their hands in this mess from the very beginning and are up to their elbows in blood, too. Where is their accountability? There is none -- not allowed to question them or their motives!
Solution is in unity but unity cannot be forced, common sense in necessary on all interested sides. Of course you can always be pushovers if this position fits you well...
Let's start with "I am an American, Lukasz", of Montenegrin Serb descent and my family has been in the US for nearly 100 years, so I have no reason to defend anything that I don't believe to be true.
But, in that vein, "the solution is NO longer unity". These people will never live in anything like "a Yugoslavia" again. They have been so fractured along ethnic and religious lines that even cooperating in the statelets that have been created is difficult, if not impossible. ("Bosnia" is an aberation, not "a country".) But hopefully, they will be able to cooperate as seperate countries in the same neighborhood.
However, the EU does now have a reason to justify its existence -- all these little statelets need the EU in ways that every third-world country does, and in ways that the larger EU countries had started to balk at until they saw the economic prospects of "cheap labor" in the starelts and within the EU. So perhaps, all that blood was worth it -- to someone!
They were bombed cause they didn’t follow their own interests.
Let's start with "I am an American, Lukasz", of Montenegrin Serb descent and my family has been in the US for nearly 100 years, so I have no reason to defend anything that I don't believe to be true.
I knew that you are from US, just don’t know how long. Probably the only Balkaners on FR is kronos77, the rest are Americans of Balkan decent like you whom just love to argue with each other.
Are you the only true poster from Balkans/former Yugoslavia ? (except one Slovenian who post rarely)
Beats the hell out of shooting one another!
By the way, I heard Poland is "dry country" for the next four days of the Pope's visit. Sad....
Why sad? The rain was sent from heaven after all :)
Im from Serbia, northern province, Vojvodina.
And I live there aswell.
Transdniestrian NGOs want Russia to patronize independence referendum
TIRASPOL. May 24 (Interfax) - Transdniestrian nongovernmental organizations want Russia to act as a guarantor in a referendum on the region's independence.
"A trend toward the resolution of political issues in conflict zones through referendums has emerged recently. The latest example is the voting in Montenegro. A similar referendum should also be held in Transdniestria," the Anti-Blockade Coordinating Council of Transdniestria non-governmental organizations said in an address sent to the Russian president and the State Duma on Wednesday.
"The voting in Montenegro was held under the auspices of the European Union. We propose that the referendum in Transdniestria be held under Russia's auspices," the document says.
"Russia could act as a guarantor in the Transdniestrian referendum. Russia's presidency of the Council of Europe Committee of Ministers gives it additional resources for this," the document says.
"A number of international legal norms are now being violated in relation to Transdniestria," it says.
But, gat a look on this:
http://www.kommersant.com/page.asp?id=676646
Disagreement was also seen in the parties' attitude to the referendum that resulted in Montenegro's decision to secede from its union with Serbia, with Schussel repeatedly pointing out its democratic and conciliated nature and Putin talking about a single standard applicable to Transdniestria, South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Then he unexpectedly returned to the subject of China and said that it was not an alternative energy market to Europe. This led to a request for commentary on U.S. Vice President Dick Cheney's recent speech in Vilnius, where he sharply criticized Russian policies. That question was circumvented and the press conference ended.
--
What now. Putin is abviously aplying his earlier promiss given over Kosovo, vhen he said, something like "Like Kosovo, Like Transdniestria", now "Like Montenegro, Like Transdniestria"
Most important:
Entire dialogue was about Russian energy resources, an watch old KGB collonel talking: he was saying "Like Montenegro, like Transdniestra" and than "Suddenly shifting" to "China and said that it was not an alternative energy market to Europe."
Translation:
"We will blackmail you and if nothing else, we will sell gas and oil to China instead you"
Yep they sure did kill a lot of Serbs you pinhead.
Finally some NGO's Russia won't ban.
and the Russians talk about interferience of the foreign NGO's in Russia :)
Not that marky thinks there's anything wrong with that.
Too bad it wasn't "manna"! ;>)
Having a "voice in Europe" is not as important as having our own state and getting out of Yugoslavia which failed miserably twice. Maybe it's time for Poland, Belarus, the Ukraine and Russia to unite?
1. One would not understand what other is talking about.
2. With exception of Belarus, these countries are already big enough (Belarus would be a giant in the western Balkans)
3. Russia is Asiatic
4. We are truly separate nations (although level of awareness of this fact among Belarusians is questionable )
Sorry but I don’t see what is the difference between all of you beside religion with is not a base to create a separate nation. You also didn’t provided any evidences to proof that my statement is incorrect. So, I assume that your opinion is based on simple bias.
Having a "voice in Europe" is not as important as having our own state and getting out of Yugoslavia which failed miserably twice.
It failed yes, because all Balkaners betrayed own interests.
Sorry, but there is no such thing as a "Balkan interest". The various peoples' history, culture, and attitudes are different enough in that Yugoslavia twice failed (and for good reason). The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result. Europe did well with small states for centuries, I see no reason why it can't now. We're not interested in rule from Belgrade since it killed us, bled us dry, and almost wiped us out. Why you propose trying this a third time is beyond me.
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