Well 9 times out of 10 I'd go with the exact opposite of what most college professors are saying about anything! (but that's another story).
Furthermore there are always maximum penalties and or penalties on the books that judges see fit to give a lesser degree of punishment (and that still isn't amnesty).
When one gets a speeding ticket and has to pay a hefty fine but is put on probation for 6 months without accruing *points*...is that amnesty?
Furthermore the notion that we are going to round up 11 million people and remove / deport them is simply silly. It ain't going happen (and you and I both know it). Hell we could hardly remove one little Cuban boy back to his Father in Cuba without this country erupting on itself.
Outside of the very serious logistics alone of trying to do such -
Wait just a minute. The law books call for these individuals to be deported, no exceptions. Tha tis amnesty. W is saying we will create another penalty for them, plus he adds a reward.
" Furthermore there are always maximum penalties and or penalties on the books that judges see fit to give a lesser degree of punishment (and that still isn't amnesty).
When one gets a speeding ticket and has to pay a hefty fine but is put on probation for 6 months without accruing *points*...is that amnesty? "
No, since that is the normal punishment for such a minor offense. And when one is deported for violating the immigration law, that is not amnesty, but the normal punishment. But if you let violent murderers off that light (fine and probabtion) in violation of sentencing guidelines, it would/should be called amnesty or pardon.
The punishment/cure for illegal immigration is deportation, so letting illegal immigrants become legal without deportation *is* amnesty. Anything other than deportation or jail is a form of amnesty, the punishment is forgone.
Moreover:
1) there is ZERO punishment in the 2006 amnesty provisions. It is voluntary. Nobobdy is forced to get an H2C visa and then get citizenship. No judge makes them do this, its an application they send it.
2) $2000 is far from hefty. It is smaller than the cost of going through a legal H1B visa, when you add up the fees and lawyer costs! Frankly, its little more than a processing fee.
3) This bill is structured exactly like the 1986 bill, which everybody calls amnesty - you are supposed to learn English, you have some residency reqt, you have some work reqt, and you cant be a criminal; oh, and pay some fine/fee. WE DID THIS IN 1986 AND IT WAS CALLED AMNESTY.
4) It's a phony talkping-point of the pro-amnesty side, including Bush, to talk of "automatic path to citizenship" as what amnesty means. Wrong.Even if it didnt have an automatic path to citizenship, it would be amnesty, since it is forgoing the punishment (deportation). Even if we didnt have the social security giveaway, and even if we didnt let them go straight into permanent residency status within 6 years, it would be amnesty.
5) But wait there is more! ... The Senate in a huge giveaway now granted credit for fraulent deposits of Soc Sec taxes to illegal immigrants, meaning this - they pay a small fine of $2000, and get access to - welfare benefits, social security, medicare, etc. $2000 is not a fine, its like a country club or Sams Club membership fee.
The Senate bill loads up a whole bunch of goodies to 'entice' people into legalized status, it goes beyond amnesty, to a huge giveaway/reward for illegals.
So dont call it amensty if you wish - call it Sham-nesty.
"Furthermore the notion that we are going to round up 11 million people and remove / deport them is simply silly."
Yes, it is quite silly of the pro-amnesty crowd to use this strawman, as if the only choices are mass deportation or turning all 11 million into citizens. Ted Kennedy used this phony argument on the Senate, and it was debunked brilliantly by Sen Sessions, will sharea in followup.