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Here is Julie Myers of ICE backing away from "the fence"

HH: Right now, I'm joined from Washington by the Assistant Secretary for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, or ICE, Julie Myers. Ms. Myers, welcome to the Hugh Hewitt Show.

JM: Oh, thanks for having me, Hugh.

HH: It's great to have you on. When the President said high tech fence, what was he talking about? How long will it be?

JM: Well, he is talking about, kind of thinking about a combination of surveillance and manpower and infrastructure, that the border patrol is seeking to do over a period of several years.

HH: But in terms of actual fencing fencing, how many miles are we talking about?

JM: Well, in terms of actual fencing, I think they're still looking at kind of what makes most sense in terms of surveillance and manpower and actual infrastructure.

HH: Is he committed, though? Did you have a talk with him about extending, for example, the San Diego fence, which is 1,400 miles long, and the El Paso fence, which is many miles long, double, and sometimes triple barrier fencing? Is that on the table?

JM: I think certainly all options are on the table to be most effective in terms of fencing. I am actually more the interior enforcement person, so I have not been involved in any direct discussions regarding the specifics of the fence.

HH: So we're still unclear of how far the administration is committed to actual fencing on the border? I mean, concrete, physical fencing?

JM: Well, certainly I'm not prepared to go further than what the President talked about tonight.

HH: And there were no specifics in terms of miles on that.

JM: That's correct.

HH: All right. That's disappointing, but let's move on. What about the permanent identification, the tamper proof identification. How do we get to that?

JM: Well, certainly, the President is calling upon Congress to act in this area. I think the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services would be ready to step in and help with this. As the enforcement agency, I know we would find this very useful. And for employers who want to do the right thing, we'd find that very helpful for them.

HH: How long's it take to get into production if the Congress authorizes it? Is the technology easily accessible?

JM: Well, certainly, those are the kinds of things that USCIS is looking at and exploring very vigorously. I think they would be prepared to move on a fast track, and frankly, that's what I hear from employers. They want these sort of things to move on a fast track. They don't want to be hiring illegal aliens, and they feel like just right now, with the documents they're given, they just don't know.

HH: So what do we mean by fast track? Could it be up and running in two months?

JM: Once again, I'm not the head of USCIS, but I think they will work under any deadline that Congress imposes, and work as quickly as practical to get this moving.

HH: Did the President sound the enforcement bell enough tonight, Julie Myers?

JM: Absolutely. The President is very, very committed to enforcement. He talked about the specific steps that he's been taking in terms of staffing in funding, really since the beginning of his presidency, and how now, we need to step it up even further. He's going to bring in the National Guard, and he's also going to make sure that folks like ICE partner better with state and local law enforcment.

HH: But expand on what that means, because I've got to tell you, I'm underwhelmed, because I thought you'd come out with administration talking points on the fence, which was number one to me. And obviously, they haven't issued those.

JM: Well, you know, I'm sorry, always sorry to underwhelm you, but I can tell you that as an enforcement person, I'm pleased to hear the President talk about the need for strong worksite enforcement, the need to get more border patrol agents there immediately, and also the fact that we're going to have more beds, so that we can actually put more of these individuals in beds, right away, in fiscal year 2006. This is not a pipe dream. The President is asking for the supplemental, asking for this money, asking for Congress to act now.

HH: How many more beds?

JM: He's asking for 4,000 beds through the end of fiscal year 2006. We're asking for a total of 6,700 beds in fiscal year 2007. That'll bring us up to 27,600 beds.

HH: And are they all full currently, Assistant Secretary Myers?

JM: We will be...we will have used every single bed we have at the end of this year, absolutely.

HH: And so, how long is the average stay in one of those detention facilities?

JM: Well, it depends on kind of where you are, and what sort of removal you are eligible for. If we catch you right at the border, then often, we can put you into what's called expedited removal, and we've done a ton of improvements in our processing, so we have reduced the average processing time in expedited removal from 90 days to under 30 days. So that makes the beds a lot cheaper for me, because I turn them over much more quickly. If you're not caught right on the border, if you're caught in the interior, we often have to send you through what's called a 240 proceeding. There we have reduced the average time for beds, but it still can be, you know, 50, 60, 70, 80 days. Sometimes, people are in beds for much longer than that. That's obviously very, very costly. We are working with foreign governments, and working on travel document times and everything else to reduce those times.

HH: Now as I have heard it explained by border patrol and Customs, if you catch someone at the border, you can just basically get them back over the border immediately, or in a matter of moments, correct?

JM: Well, it depends on where they're from. If they're from Mexico, that is correct.

HH: That's what I mean. 85%, I think, the President said tonight. 85%.

JM: Yes. If they are from Mexico, caught right on the border, they can remove them immediately, yes.

HH: So I'm back to the fencing conversation. If fencing is the best way to stop them at the border, why don't we have a plan laid out for that?

JM: Well, you know, I don't think we think that fencing is the best way to stop them on the border. I think the President's called for...if you build a fence, they build a tunnel. We just saw that today. There was another tunnel destroyed, another, excuse me, another tunnel found over in the San Diego area. So you can't...given the kind of the layout of our land, I believe it's the President's view, it's the border patrol's view, that a fence alone is not enough. We need a layered approach that includes surveillance, personnel, technology. We are working with the military to make sure we have the best technology. And some places, a fence may be very effective, but some places, it's simply not.

HH: Assistant Secretary Myers, correct me if I'm wrong. I think you just walked the administration back from the fence.

JM: I...no, I said consistent with what the border patrol chief's been telling me all along, he's been telling me what he needs, the combination of all these things. You look at the particular location, the particular terrain, and you decide what's most effective. You don't want something people can scale in two minutes and then be in the desert, and then you just have put people on the other side of the fence.

HH: But the idea that the fact that someone can dig a tunnel undermines the idea that a fence is effective...we'll come back.

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HH: Ms. Myers, I just want to go back over the fence, because I must tell you, I wagered everything on the President being serious about the fence, because the fence works. And whenever I've heard people talk about it, it works. It works in San Diego, it works in Israel, it works in El Paso. But I must say, I'm completely underwhelmed. It doesn't seem like you really believe in it. (pause) Ms. Myers, are you there?

JM: Certainly, the border patrol believes very strongly that what we need is, in a sense, a virtual fence in some places. We need a combination, a layered strategy that includes in some place infrastructure, other places surveillance, other places personnel.

HH: But that's understood by people who follow this debate as code words for no action at all.

JM: Well, I think that's not what you've seen tonight, is no action at all. What you saw tonight was a very strong call to action by this President, both for comprehensive immigration reform, and immediately, putting the National Guard down on the border so that we can have more boots, as they call it, boots on the ground in terms of border patrol agents actually doing their jobs.

HH: But people wanted the fence...and I'm a moderate on this. I get hammered by the deportation crowd every day. And it's always about when are they going to be serious about the physical fencing that works? And I think it's a fair interpretation of what you said, is that the administration really doesn't believe in it.

JM: I think people want results, and the President wants results. I think what he did tonight is talk about where we are so far, and how he's going to step it up and take it further with the National Guard.

HH: Ms. Myers, with all due respect, they don't want that, they want a fence. But you're telling me that the administration is not into the fence?

JM: I'm telling you I believe people want results. And when people see that we're securing the border, I don't think people will care how that's being done. And it's my understanding that the border patrol believes we need a combination of these things. In some places, fencing may be great. In other places, all you'll get is a whole bunch of tunnels.

HH: One minute left. Is there anything specific you can tell us about fencing?

JM: You know, I think we've talked about how a layered approach on the fencing is a part of the President's strategy. I will tell you that we're doing a great job in interior enforcement, and really moving out some of the areas where I think we've been...not been as active as we could have been in the past.

HH: Well, I appreciate your coming on. I must be just candid with you. I think that's disastrous, politically. I think that is a nightmare, both policy and political wise, because I thought the President had come down for the fence, but you're saying it's really a much subtler approach.

JM: Well, I appreciate your time, and we look forward to showing the great results in having the National Guard down there.

HH: All right. Thank you, Assistant Secretary for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Julie Myers. I'm just stunned.

End of interview.