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To: MACVSOG68

You stated earlier that for 1200 years the Church didn't consider the fetus as a human until "animation." That isn't true as I have proven with Church documents.

You also said that the early Christians didn't "believe that first term abortions were the taking of a human life either."

I have also proven from early Church records that isn't true.

Now you have given me 3 links that didn't come from the Vatican or any other reliable Catholic source.

Your first source is from "The Dark History of the Church,"
Seven Great Myths by Organized Religion.

Your second source is from an independent blog (apparently) on AOL.

Your third source is from a doctor who appears to be taking the pro-abortion side.

Yes, I agree that it is interesting that if you go to any Catholic site about Pope Innocent III you will see that part left out. You see, it's all part of the great Catholic conspiracy.. just like the Da Vinci Code.. (sarcasm off!)

The reason you won't find it is because it apparently only exists on liberal sites that argue against the Church and for abortion.

For example, your second source cited this as documentation:

"From the earliest days of the Church, men who had shed human blood, no matter how justifiable or blameless the act may have been, were excluded from entering the priesthood (e.g., Decretum Gratiani by Pope Innocent I in the year 404). This traditionally embraced abortion as a form of homicide. However, in 1211, Pope Innocent III issued the decree Sicut ex, which limited the irregularity incurred from abortion to abortions involving a fetus that was not "animated" or "ensouled."

There is NO such document/decree as Sicut ex that exists. I challenge you to find it at the Vatican website or any website out there. It's not there except on the site you gave. That's the only place it pops up on a googlesearch.


206 posted on 05/15/2006 3:50:48 PM PDT by FJ290
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To: FJ290
I believe this link will explain it to you better. Hopefully, you will accept "Catholics United for Faith". This is an explanation of what I have told you. Accept it or not, the Church had various positions on abortion until 1869.

It does look like an attempt to put the best light on it they could, but the fact exists that early abortions for about 1200 years was the equivalent of birth control in penalties. The paper mentions Pope Sixtus condemnation of all abortions, but fails to mention either Innocent III, or Gregory who followed Sixtus and overturned his dictum. I think most can read between the lines though, and will see the obvious. The Church never approved of any abortions, but clearly distinguished between pre-animated and post-animated abortions for much of its existence.

http://www.cuf.org/faithfacts/details_view.asp?ffID=1

207 posted on 05/15/2006 4:54:02 PM PDT by MACVSOG68
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