Posted on 05/12/2006 2:28:51 PM PDT by SmithL
European style of education would be better
Kind of, but I really don't think that Europeans are much better from what I can tell. This might actually sound a bit hypocritical when I say my next sentence. I actually agree with you about the testing in 9th or 10th grade. I mean this way if they have to be held back it would not be the senior year. I guess another problem with this particular story is that they are failing or want to fail seniors that have one month of school left. It does not seem to be a win win for anybody. I mean out of 46,000 how many will say forget it and just drop out one month prior because they will be discouraged. If these kids had failed an actual school class and some students find out they fail one month before but to me that is a different siutation because you should have some sort of feeling throught the quarter year etc that you may not fail. Taking a state exam as a requirement to get a high school degree and you do not pass one month before than you are stuck. No notice. I mean goodness a bad night of sleeping could affect these kids maybe or some just don't have the ability either way one month before graduation just seems harsh to me.
When did high school graduation become a right? By definition, a diploma is a certificate of discrimination: it purports to identify those who are educated to a given level from those who are not. If HS diplomas cannot be issued on a discriminatory basis, then I want one issued to my eight year old right now.
BTW, have you heard of any vocational schools? How do people train to become plumbers, mechanics, etc., these days?
I'm not sure about California, but in our state students start taking the test as 11th graders, and get 5 or 6 chances to pass before graduation.
They do get the results from the final test about 3 weeks before graduation, but they've had several chances to pass before that.
Again, I agree totally - and jobs like mechanic, plumber, electrician, and carpenter can't be outsourced.
In our area, some of the jobs such as carpenter and brickmason are now mostly being done by Mexicans, and I think that's partially because we aren't training young people to do that sort of job as much anymore, and partially because we're teaching our young people that doing that sort of job is "beneath them".
Even someone in a vocational field will need math at a middle school level and to be able to comprehend material written at a 10th grade level. It would benefit them to get up to that level, if they aren't already -to read plumbing manuals or the electrical code.
Not to mention that reading newspapers, voting, managing a bank account, paying taxes, and other responsibilities of everyday life require a certain skill level in reading and math.
One thing that worries me is elementary education. It seems to me that two types of people go into elementary education: those who really want to teach young children, and those who can't succeed at other college majors.
An elementary education degree is not very demanding (or at least it wasn't when I was in college, and I can say that from having taken some of the courses - I don't think it's changed much since then).
I took a "Teaching Math in the Elementary School" course in 1976 or 1977, and there were potential teachers there who had trouble doing math at a 6th grade level, and didn't like science or math anyway.
There's another thread posted yesterday about the best high schools in the United States, and there was a line in the original article about "the best way to improve high schools is to improve elementary and middle schools". I think that's quite true - if they don't have the skills when they reach high school, it's difficult if not impossible to teach them at a high school level.
I'm not sure about California, but in our state students start taking the test as 11th graders, and get 5 or 6 chances to pass before graduation.
Thank you. I was watching FOXNEWS after I was on line and they said they get to take it six times plus it is multiple choice and has questions as if you have a product that costs 100 dollars and it is 25 percent off, how much do you save. Well I change my mind and find that if they can't pass this type of test than maybe I am on the side of the pro-test people.
Yet another leftist judge legislating from the bench. How quaint.
You have my "FReeper of the Week" award...very few people would admit here on the forum that they've changed their minds about anything! :-)
As if California high school diplomas weren't worthless enough already. Maybe Lord Freedman could order a Master's degree to be given to all the students.
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