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Pentagon considers sending troops to border
Reuters ^ | 05.12.06 | Will Dunham

Posted on 05/12/2006 1:11:34 PM PDT by VU4G10

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Pentagon has begun drawing up plans to send troops and equipment to the U.S. border with Mexico, where hundreds of thousands of migrants enter the country illegally each year, a defense official said on Friday.

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld discussed border issues at the Pentagon with his Mexican counterpart, Defense Minister Gen. Gerardo Clemente Ricardo Vega. Mexico and the United States share a 2,000-mile border.

"The U.S. and Mexican governments continue to work together to control the border and collaborate on these important efforts," said U.S. Navy Lt. Cmdr. J.D. Gordon, a Pentagon spokesman.

"This cooperation includes limited U.S. assistance with training, equipping and funding Mexico security forces so that they can better meet our shared challenges in protecting the border," he said.

Immigration has emerged as one of the top political issues of 2006. President George W. Bush will address the nation on immigration reform on Monday as the Senate renews debate on a bill to tighten border security and give an estimated 12 million illegal immigrants a way to legalize their status.

A defense official, speaking on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the issue, said the Defense Department is exploring options for possible use of troops or military assets to help with border security.

Citing what some members called "an invasion" of illegal immigrants across the southern U.S. border, the House of Representatives voted 252-171 on Thursday to permit the Pentagon to assign forces to help in border protections.

Gordon noted that while the U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency, under the Department of Homeland Security, is responsible for securing the U.S. borders with Mexico and Canada, the U.S. military performs a limited support role.

For example, military unmanned aerial vehicles have provided border surveillance.

He said any additional military role would be temporary until more civilian border agents could be recruited and trained.

Gordon noted that border security is a civilian law enforcement function. The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, enacted during the post-Civil War reconstruction period, prohibits federal military personnel from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States.

However, National Guard troops come under the command of state governors, who can use them for purposes such as border security. The president also has the power to federalize these troops.


TOPICS: Front Page News; Government; Mexico; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: cabins; camping; longleave; swimmingpools; weinieroasts
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To: NEMDF

SORRY FOR 3 posts.. my computer was hanging up.

HAVE A NICE MOTHER'S DAY


41 posted on 05/12/2006 1:46:13 PM PDT by NEMDF
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To: Yo-Yo
Not necessarily directed at you, but from another post I made earlier today when things got ugly on another thread:

Good grief people...first of all, the Governors could have activated the NG at any time, but didn't. No, they wait around for the FedGov to act, then feign relief like there was nothing they could have done without the FedGov. I call BS. Also, Bush has supported the fence idea for a year, but the Dems didn't like it:

May 2005 - The border fence provision is part of the REAL ID Act of 2005, which is attached to the House's emergency supplemental appropriations package to finance military spending in Iraq and Afghanistan.In a letter to Congress last week, the White House said, "The administration strongly urges [congressional] conferees to include the REAL ID Act of 2005 in the final version of the bill." The legislation also includes a ban on driver's licenses for illegal immigrants.

Democrats are bristling over the Bush endorsement, with Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid saying he was "disappointed."

"The fact of the matter is Republicans did this in a very tricky way," Reid Spokeswoman Fabiola Rodriguez-Ciampoli told The Associated Press. "They knew that if they included REAL ID in the [military spending bill], it would be very hard to strike it out."

The fences were finally approved by Congress and work has begun, but many sections have been delayed by environmentalists:

A corrugated metal fence that separates the USA from Mexico starts near here at the Pacific Ocean and runs 14 miles inland. It's a stained and rusty reminder that San Diego was once the place along the U.S.-Mexico border most often crossed by illegal immigrants. The government decided in 1996 to add two more fences with roads and stadium-style lights in between the rows to make it easier to stop anyone who tried to get across.

The project has progressed so roughly 10 miles of the multiple fences and roads are built. But work on the final 3 1/2 miles or so has hit a snag: Border security is in conflict with environmental concerns.

Human Rights groups and local leaders also held it up,calling it "racist":

At the forum, The Organic Collective distributed a statement that reads, “The Triple Border Fence embodies the most racist and violent face of so called ‘Free Trade’ which allows capital to flow freely across borders, but not the people who create the capital.”

The space for increased human right abuses was another concern expressed by several panelists. “(The triple border fence) creates a space of impunity for the Border Patrol,” Christian Ramirez, Program Coordinator of the U.S./Mexico Border Program at The American Friends Service Committee, said. “(Within the border fences) there are no witnesses to human rights violations,” Ramirez added.

Likening the proposed project to a U.S. version of the Berlin Wall, Enrique Morones, founder of Border Angels and Chair of the Border Commission to Mexican President Vicente Fox, said, “This fence gives the wrong message and it is hypocritical. The U.S. tells Gorbachev to take down their wall, and here our President still has his.”

Besides environmental and human rights concerns, the triple fence is seen as an insult to our un-consulted Mexican neighbor and as a nemesis to cooperative border culture.

There is even a picture of National Guardsmen building the fence you say is non-existent at that website.

Finally, if you don't have a clue what you are talking about, it is usually best to keep your mouth shut so you won't look like a fool. If you are on the internet, I assume you have access to Google...use it, inform yourselves.

Post #183 with links

I figured I'd better get my word in edgewise before the Bush Bashers {pardon the pun} migrated to this thread.

42 posted on 05/12/2006 1:48:37 PM PDT by ravingnutter
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To: ravingnutter

Bump!


43 posted on 05/12/2006 1:50:26 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: VU4G10
I think it's smoke and mirrors, however if true it will be the onlything that can ensure a republican victory in November. Here's to the possibility of the party finding it's spine.

I hope on Monday I here the words "deploy" and "troops" come out of his mouth.
44 posted on 05/12/2006 1:51:08 PM PDT by spikeytx86 (Pray for Democrats for they have been brainwashed by there fruity little club.)
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To: VU4G10

About time


45 posted on 05/12/2006 1:55:59 PM PDT by Jontherocks
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To: Cementjungle

The ACLU would put a stop to this in a heartbeat.
///////////////////////////////////////////////


How legally?


46 posted on 05/12/2006 1:56:02 PM PDT by photodawg
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To: VU4G10

I'll believe it when i see it.

And even when i see it, i still won't believe it.


47 posted on 05/12/2006 1:57:42 PM PDT by uncitizen
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To: VU4G10
Gordon noted that border security is a civilian law enforcement function. The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, enacted during the post-Civil War reconstruction period, prohibits federal military personnel from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States.

Border security, as opposed to enforcement of customs and other international commerce regulations, is a military function. It's also a Constitutional power, and requirement, of the federal government.

Art IV, section 4, Constitution for the United States

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.

Posse Commutatus is just a law, not a Constitutional imperative. It was passed in the post Civil War era to prevent the US Military from being used to prevent former Confederate officers from voting in federal elections. Prior to the Civil War it was routine for federal military to be stationed at polling places during federal elections to prevent "inebriates" and others not eligible to vote from voting. See this interesting USAF Air University Review article, which goes on to say that:

"Contrary to popular thought, the prohibitions against using regular troops or federalized National Guard units in law enforcement are not absolute. The exceptions and enabling structures are written into the language of the statues. The Constitution has always required the President to be the keeper of public order. If the President receives a request from a state governor for assistance to quell public disorder, the President may issue a proclamation to the effect that order has broken down, and that those responsible must disperse. This proclamation is similar to the pre-1947 Riot Act. If order is not restored, the President may direct the Attorney General and the Secretary of Defense to apply whatever assets may be necessary to do so. Because of its plenary nature, this presidential authority is not subject to judicial review. "

Since the language of the US Code containing the prohibition says, "except in such cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress", the Congress could either authorize use of the military to prevent illegal entry into the country, as it has already done in the case of anti drug smuggling efforts, or the President could declare that enforcing the border is part of the Constitutional requirement to "protect against invasion" and send them there on his own hook.

Furthermore, the Air and Army National Guard are not subject to posses commitatas unless federalized. Any Governor of a border state could send them to the border to reverse the breakdown in law along the border. Or a governor could request the President to act, similar to what was done in the Rodney King riots case above.

48 posted on 05/12/2006 2:03:23 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: uncitizen

SO the DoD doesn't have money to process security clearances for personnel has money to deploy the troops?


49 posted on 05/12/2006 2:05:45 PM PDT by battlecry
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To: Cementjungle
The ACLU would put a stop to this in a heartbeat.Bill Richardson (D) NM and Janet Napalitano (D) AZ requested the guard on the border. They may get what they wish for and the ACLU may eat their own in the ensuing battle. (If the Republican MAJORITY has the balls to make this happen)
50 posted on 05/12/2006 2:09:03 PM PDT by pfflier
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To: SailormanCGA72
Mr. President and Mr. Rumsfeld how about stopping talking the talk and start walking the walk? You're about 4 years overdue.

It is not a problem created by this administration. They inherited it from previous administrations (1941 and on) who have neglected to address the issue also. This may be the administration that provides a long overdue fix to the problem.

Quit griping and support the President for a change. Maybe his numbers will get above 30% again and CNN/CBS will shut up about conservatives bailing on the President, about his impending imeachment, and about their annointed presidental pick, the hildabeast.

51 posted on 05/12/2006 2:17:49 PM PDT by pfflier
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To: battlecry
SO the DoD doesn't have money to process security clearances for personnel has money to deploy the troops?

Doesn't quite figure.....

I expect the whole "we're considering putting troops on the border" is gonna be among the first things that Pres Bush mentions in his speech for Monday night. (course "considering" ain't the same as "doing"). Then he'll drop the bomb on us that we have to support this bill because "Americans are a compassionate people blah blah blah", and then finally the cameras will pan to all the faces of the House members in the audience to shame them into voting for the bill.

52 posted on 05/12/2006 2:22:29 PM PDT by uncitizen
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To: GAB-1955
OK, explain this one: Robert Earl Hosea Gonzales Bundestrat Wright

We called him "Ditto" for short.

53 posted on 05/12/2006 2:34:32 PM PDT by TexasRedeye (Eschew obfuscation)
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To: Cementjungle

"The ACLU would put a stop to this in a heartbeat."


Stopping bullets and explosive shells with paper is a futile and fruitless gesture.


54 posted on 05/12/2006 2:37:50 PM PDT by DarthVader (Conservatives aren't always right , but Liberals are almost always wrong.)
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To: All

"The president will be laying out his "comprehensive" proposal for immigration reform," White House spokesman Tony Snow said.

Scary..


55 posted on 05/12/2006 2:41:18 PM PDT by VU4G10 (Have You Forgotten?)
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To: VU4G10

But conservative anger at the guest-worker idea helped fuel an erosion of support from the president's Republican base. Some conservatives view the program as a type of amnesty for illegal immigrants -- a characterization Bush rejects.


56 posted on 05/12/2006 2:42:10 PM PDT by VU4G10 (Have You Forgotten?)
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To: El Gato; ravingnutter
You said:
"the Governors could have activated the NG at any time, but didn't" - ravingnutter
and
"Any Governor of a border state could send them to the border to reverse the breakdown in law along the border." - El Gato

Both are true, but its not quite that simple. While ANG and ARNG troops report through a chain of command to the Governor when not mobilized, they are still paid by the Federal government. States only contribute around 25% of the cost of facilities maintenance. Once called into State service (State Active Duty - SAD) the state must pay an equivalent salary and reimburse the Feds for the cost of Federal resources used and equipment borrowed. The Guard is cheap day-to-day with a small fulltime force and a large force that drills once a month and a couple of weeks per year. No state could afford to have the Guard on extended state duty for long - even wildfires and flood relief is usually reimbursed to the states after a Federal disaster declaration.

If its true President Bush will order National Guard troops to the border, the Feds will be paying.
57 posted on 05/12/2006 2:52:00 PM PDT by Wimpy329 (Does that seem right to you? - Jubal Early)
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To: VU4G10

If the invaders were armed there would be no question of defending our borders with troops. These invaders are not armed but their intention is the same; to occupy territory, seize resources and impose their own language, customs and laws.


58 posted on 05/12/2006 3:15:17 PM PDT by R.W.Ratikal
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To: VU4G10
"The president will be laying out his "comprehensive" proposal for immigration reform," White House spokesman Tony Snow said. Scary..

That is very scary. If he says "comprehensive plan" fifty more times or says anything about "jobs Americans won't do" he will only make the situation worse. Ugh, I am so scared for him, for us.

He should lay out his plan to secure the border (troops, walls, surveillance etc) and delay all reform until such time the border is secure. Period.

I think prayers are in order --- for him....and us.

59 posted on 05/12/2006 4:17:13 PM PDT by redgirlinabluestate
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To: VU4G10

Bush, locked in a test of wills with some conservatives furious at his support for legalizing some illegal immigrants, will stand firm in his support for a guest-worker program and his opposition to a mass deportation of the estimated 12 million immigrants in the country, the official said.


60 posted on 05/12/2006 4:56:38 PM PDT by VU4G10 (Have You Forgotten?)
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