[bondjamesbond]

This is Andrew Sullivan's problem, not mine.

Let's just get that put away from the very start.

[small voice in the wilderness]

It's just funny to watch them twist, turn, babble, deny, decry, defy, denigrate, delineate, deprecate, dismiss, add to, take from, ignore, skip over, excuse, accuse, refuse, signify, justify, alibi, promote, provoke, misquote, blow smoke, defend, pretend, retract, subtract, attack, react, search, besmirch, and coerce. And still, the knowledge of the truth is never attained.

[denydenydeny]

Let's just say that Andrew's problem is that he likes the kneeling more than the actual Christian stuff.

[BibChr]

Sullivan's real "Problem with Christianism" is the same as his problem with Christianity and the same as his problem with Christ. It's a problem he shares with millions, including many FReepers. Here it is:

It makes him feel bad about his pet sin.

Dan
Biblical Christianity BLOG
Pyromaniacs

[Osage Orange]

There are lay Catholics who, while personally devout, are socially liberal on issues like contraception, gay rights, women's equality and a multi-faith society

ROFLOL!!

Now there's the oxymoronic statement of the day....

[sauropod]

Isn't Andrew Sullivan gay?

And his being gay, doesn't make all that he says suspect? How can one be a practicing gay person and a practicing Christian? Cognitive dissonance doesn't cut it.

[agrace]

And there are those who simply believe that, by definition, God is unknowable to our limited, fallible human minds and souls. If God is ultimately unknowable, then how can we be so certain of what God's real position is on, say, the fate of Terri Schiavo? Or the morality of contraception? Or the role of women? Or the love of a gay couple?

Because first He gave us prophets and the criteria by which to accept or reject them. Later on He gave us His written Word.

What to do about it? The worst response, I think, would be to construct something called the religious left.

There's already a very sizable religious left - does he really believe there isn't? Its members include the World Council of Churches and enlightened guys like Bishop Spong and nominal Catholics who think they can make up their own rules like John Kerry, Ted Kennedy and Kate Michelman.

[EyeGuy]

I think I'll adopt a mirror-image of Sullivan's tired modus operandi:

I'm really a liberal who disagrees, except for a few key issues, which I will throw out every now and then to keep everyone off balance, with pretty much everything that modern liberalism stands for.

Problem is, Personally I can not find one left wing position that I can even pretend to be in agreement with.

[Suzy Quzy]

His desire to engage in homosexuality AT ANY COST has made him unhinged. Where his P*nis is is more importnat than where his soul will be.

[PetroniusMaximus]

"And there are those who simply believe that, by definition, God is unknowable to our limited, fallible human minds and souls. If God is ultimately unknowable, then how can we be so certain of what God's real position is o­n, say, the fate of Terri Schiavo? Or the morality of contraception? Or the role of women? Or the love of a gay couple?"

simple...

Deuteronomy 29:29
"The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law."

[Fruitbat]

So Christ is a conservative Republican?

Here's a clue Andrew, and since apparently you know the Bible so well, liberalism and all of its beliefs, you know, Godly things such as:

Ripping living babies from the womb after "Osterizing" them [read hacking them into tiny bits];

Favoring the killing of innocent adults for whatever reasons are politically expedient;

Stripping references to God and Judeo-Christian morals out of every semblance of American life;

Favoring leniency towards people that destroy life, you know, Hussein, violent felons and child molestors, et al.;

Desiring to give equal credence to gods and religions when Jesus Christ himself stated that he and he alone was the only way to the Father! Or haven't you read that one quite yet. I realize that it's in the lesser read four gospels.

Paul, you know, the author of the vast majority of the NT after the gospels, also says that if anyone will not work, then neither should he eat. (2 Thess. 3) Yet, liberalism takes the opposite view. Food for all regardless of how lazy or unwilling to work they may be.

How many of those things do you think that Jesus Christ and the Living God, you know, the pivotal figures of Christianity, agree with there Andrew?!

There's more, but that should be more than enough to tie up your mind in coming up with more ridiculous excuses as answers to them.

And since Conservatisim is the antithesis of liberalism, and frankly, built on Judeo-Christian values, that yes, Christ would be much more inline with Conservative ideology!

[the OlLine Rebel]

WHERE IS THE BARF ALERT????

[the OlLine Rebel]

"The distinction between Christian and Christianist echoes the distinction we make between Muslim and Islamist."


(Here we go again with insane absurdity; *sigh*)

I make no distinction between "Moslem" and "Islamist". The religion just plain is hostile and hateful, whether you're passive or not.

So, trying to tie in any Christians at all in with Moslem so-called "extremists" - or Islam at all - is absurd and ridiculous to me.

[Seruzawa]

A.S.hole doesn't seem to understand that Jesus was emphatically NOT a liberal. He had no tolerance for fuzzy thinking and didn't think that we were supposed to follow the Ten Commandments only if we felt like it. He didn't ever refer to them as the Ten Suggestions. Not once.

A.S's got the usual problem liberals have with Christians who actually try to live their religion. He doesn't like the idea of compassion and love that still demands a person act with the moral authority to resist evil. He wants to define a "good Christian" as someone who goes along with the degradation of the moral level of society as promoted by the liberowackjobs that currently run the demonRATS.

[William Terrell]

Mr. Sullivan, please explain to me how a person can be a socialist liberal and be a Christian, too.

[Fruitbat]

Yet the term "people of faith" has been co-opted almost entirely in our discourse by those who see Christianity as compatible with only one political party, the Republicans, and believe that their religious doctrines should determine public policy for everyone.

As well there Andrew, I have a problem with people that "co-opt," to borrow your word in your absurd piece, Christianity and turn it into whatever it is that they want.

Again, since you're so well-versed in the Scriptures, that would be the Bible, naturally you're aware of what Paul, again, you know, the author of most of the NT that you claim to believe in, says about those that tailor the Scriptures to their own needs, eh.

2 Tim 4:3

3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,

I'll just go ahead and toss you into that category there Andrew! Pardon my judging you, but hey, let's just call it what it is, OK.

[olezip]

Sounds just like another liberal making comparisons, labeling people, and making judgements. The writer should just live his faith and not worry about what others are doing or thinking. Basically it reads like jibberish; what is he really blabbing about on and on and on? What is his problem?

[Alex Murphy]

Ping to read later.

[nightdriver]

I seriously doubt that Sullivan is a Christian, seeing as how he doesn't even seem to know what constitutes Christianity.

For one thing, Christianity is not just a hobby. If it was, it would have never been persecuted in ancient Rome. It would just be another check point in the pantheon of the time.

This old saw about everyone tolerating everyone else is a fantasy.

[joebuck]

"There are very orthodox believers who nonetheless respect the freedom and conscience of others as part of their core understanding of what being a Christian is. They have no problem living next to an atheist or a gay couple or a single mother or people whose views on the meaning of life are utterly alien to them--and respecting their neighbors' choices."

Those last five words tell you everything you need to know about where Andrew is coming from. He wants us to love the sinner AND the sin. Sorry Andrew, I have no right to judge you because I am a sinner also BUT I have a duty NOT to "respect my neighbors choices" when those choices involve living a life of sin. The Christ of my Bible tells me I must reject sinful choices with my heart and soul. Jesus will always help you out of your sin but he will never help you in your sin.

[redgolum]

This is Andrew Sullivan's problem, not mine. Let's just get that put away from the very start.

Very soon it will be every Christians problem. In much of Europe, after the revolutions of the late 19th and early 20th century, Christianity was regulated to "only behind closed doors". Europe was very deliberately de Christianized.