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To: SJSAMPLE
Also, you can't really compare pistol rounds to rifle rounds. Pistol rounds are designed to retain as much of the original mass as possible.

You've managed to convince me that you don't have even the most basic clue as to what you are talking about. FMJ, aka Military Ball, is specifically designed to stay in one piece for maximum penetration. It is specifically designed not to fragment. Check out the mil-spec on it sometime. You couldn't possibly be more wrong.

The only modern combat ammunition that is designed to fragment is pre-fragmented rounds, and these are not in use in any army in the world. I don't know how in the world you are calling that crap "combat" ammunition. It is designed so that it will not penetrate the interior walls of your house and kill your kids instead of an intruder.

One of the hardest things to do with a high-velocity round is to get it to expand, while staying together. Rifle rounds, like pistol rounds, are SPECIFICALLY designed to retain as much mass as possible for as long as possible. Military Ball ammo does NOT fragment except for extreme conditions. The only exceptions to FMJ staying in one piece are extremely thin walled varmint rounds.

You don't know anything about rifles, pistols, or the ammo used in either. You sound like you are getting all of your vast amount of knowledge from Myth Busters or something.

107 posted on 04/18/2006 11:17:38 AM PDT by wyattearp (Study! Study! Study! Or BONK, BONK, on the head!)
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To: wyattearp

What?!

I specifically stated that "Pistol rounds are designed to retain as much of the original mass as possible".

And your next three sentences confirmed EXACTLY what I said. Read my post (carefully, this time), then re-read what you posted.

M-16 rounds, unlike pistol rounds, rely on fragmentation as a "primary wounding mechanism". Punching a neat .223 hole doesn't do much if it misses a) vital organs, b) parts of the CNS (central nervous system) or c) veins and arteries. Military FMJ rounds WILL NOT expand in soft tissue, so fragmentation is the only alternative.

People who know what they're talking about realize that the limitation of M-16 ammo is that it fails most when it fails to fragment in human tissue. The next thing you'll be spouting is that M855 is "armor piercing" because of the tungsten rod.

Here is an excellent source from people, like me, who have considerable experience with wide range of 5.56mm ammunition:

www.ammo-oracle.com


I reload TENS OF THOUSANDS of rounds of 5.56mm, 9mm, .40SW and .45ACP every year and consider myself firmly aware of the abilities and limitations of most common ammunition.

And it's not "pre-fragmented" ammunition, it's
"frangible" ammunition, like the Hornady TAP round, which was based on their varmint rounds.

You come off like a jerk and you have the knowlege that proves it.


108 posted on 04/18/2006 11:40:10 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: wyattearp

Oh, and when you go to that site, please note the pics of MILITARY BALL 55gr FMJ that fragmented in ballistic gelatin. Hardly "extreme conditions".


109 posted on 04/18/2006 11:43:19 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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