Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Polybius
The problem with a national ID card is the same as with currency, radar guns, encryption, etc. The private marketplace, or in some cases, the black market, has and will find ways to defeat government technology. There is no fail safe system that will prevent forgery. With a requirement for a national ID card for establishing bank accounts, obtaining employment, receiving social benefits, etc., there will develop a black market such as already exists for drivers' licenses, Mexican conciliar cards, etc. Higher tech cards will only weed out the "mom and pop" forgers, much as the restrictions on cold medicines containing amphetamines are placing the trailer park "drug labs" out of business, or, in the Prohibition era, the Mafia pushed the backyard and basement bootleggers out of business. Organized crime will issue national ID cards that will fool the run of the mill employer, bank, and social services agency. They will be expensive, but the same illegals who pay $1,000 or $2,000 for "coyotes" to enable their border crossings will spend a similar amount of money for a good quality, fake national ID card. Keep in mind that organized crime has an effective wholesale and retail narcotics distribution in place, and has accomplished this for decades in spite of local, state, and Federal law enforcement.

Even in an area where the Feds hold most of the cards, as in the issuance of currency, the problem of counterfeiting is important enough to require frequent remakes of paper money. It will be exceptionally more difficult to control forgeries when hundreds of thousands of separate actors, rather than just the U.S. Treasury Department, review documentation. You might as well try to herd cats.

Additionally, I am also assuming that the Feds are willing to enforce laws prohibiting illegal immigration. The current Administration and its predecessor have been extremely lax in this area.

The national ID card is another big government failure waiting to happen.

85 posted on 04/19/2006 9:18:15 AM PDT by Wallace T.
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 84 | View Replies ]


To: Wallace T.; XJarhead
The problem with a national ID card is the same as with currency, radar guns, encryption, etc. The private marketplace, or in some cases, the black market, has and will find ways to defeat government technology. There is no fail safe system that will prevent forgery. With a requirement for a national ID card for establishing bank accounts, obtaining employment, receiving social benefits, etc., there will develop a black market such as already exists for drivers' licenses, Mexican conciliar cards, etc. Higher tech cards will only weed out the "mom and pop" forgers, much as the restrictions on cold medicines containing amphetamines are placing the trailer park "drug labs" out of business, or, in the Prohibition era, the Mafia pushed the backyard and basement bootleggers out of business. Organized crime will issue national ID cards that will fool the run of the mill employer, bank, and social services agency...............Wallace T.

In 1946, the vast majority of shopping in the U.S. was done by Americans exchanging printed pieces of paper with fancy engraving and portraits of U.S. Presidents on them.

Today, $2.4 Trillion (that's Trillion with a T) worth of purchases are made in the U.S. each year with cheap plastic cards with magnetic strips on the back.

You have just argued that the way that modern Americans pay for the vast majority of purchases in 2006, from the gas station to the supermarket, it not practical and therefore just a Buck Rogers pipe dream.

Unless the merchant has lost computer access and accepts a paper imprint of credit card on faith, the credit card does not work by fooling the merchant. The credit card works by convincing the database at American Express, or Bank of America or Chase Bank that it is legitimate, has not been canceled, has not been reported stolen, has not expired, has not gone over the credit limit, matches the name and number and security code, etc, etc, etc....................and the computer can do all of that in a microsecond.

A forger can easily forge a VISA card. However, that forged VISA card and a dollar won't buy you a cup of coffee at Starbucks if the Chase Bank computer database rejects the VISA card when it is swiped.

Likewise, a forger can easily forge a National ID Card but that forged card will be worth squat when the U.S. Government computer database rejects that card when it is swiped.

In Post 82, XJarhead describes the current system of verifying identity for employment. It is a snail mail and paper-pushing system straight out of the Civil War era.

It's time to join the 21st Century.

As XJarhead said in Post 82, "How can any rational person not object to having to show an I.D. and SSN, but fight tooth and nail against updating those documents to make forgery more difficult? Damn, make your SSN card or other I.D. that you already are required to show an electronic swipe card. It instantly will run through computers, and the employer gets an answer back in 5 minutes as to whether or not you are illegal."

86 posted on 04/19/2006 5:40:22 PM PDT by Polybius
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson