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To: timsbella

A lot of this makes sense, except for one thing. I don't understand how a volcanic eruption could kill the first born of the Egyptians. The Nile turning red - yes, the frogs, locusts etc. - yes, but the first born of the Egyptians dying? And not the Hebrews because of lamb blood on the door lintels? A volcanic explanation for that just doesn't make sense.


12 posted on 04/14/2006 6:25:55 AM PDT by Tokra (I think I'll retire to Bedlam.)
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To: Tokra

I haven't see this show, so I can't speak to it specifically. I do recall another show, possibly from the Learning Channel or National Geographic, which makes similar arguements. Quite compelling. Not so much the first born as death due to the conditions which occured from the previous nine plagues.


15 posted on 04/14/2006 6:28:46 AM PDT by timsbella (Mark Steyn for Prime Minister of Canada!)
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To: Tokra

There are some things that just have to be taken on faith. The need to explain God's miracles and power in view of our finite understanding is senseless. Attempting to explain how natural phenomenon could lead to the plagues or the crossing of the Red Sea ultimately just undercuts our faith. "Dispute not because you see not."


29 posted on 04/14/2006 7:03:25 AM PDT by Galena Nevada
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To: Tokra

It would make sense if, as slaves, the Jews were made to live in camps in a highground or some other sector away from the lava flow. But I never heard that lava flow was the method to strike down the firstborn... and it would seem to be more indiscriminate - that it would kill second born and moms and dads too.


71 posted on 04/14/2006 12:47:39 PM PDT by monkeyshine
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To: Tokra

I don't understand how a volcanic eruption could kill the first born of the Egyptians. The Nile turning red - yes, the frogs, locusts etc. - yes, but the first born of the Egyptians dying? ........... the death of the first born was caused by the grain being harvested and stored when wet, and covered in locust droppings. The grain storage pits were then covered with sand which made them hot and humid, ideal for growing bacteria.

The identity of this bacteria was found when DR Edwardo Montagnia of the Atlanta Center for Disease Control was called in by Cleveland doctors to find out why children were dying. This cause was identified as "Stachybotrys atra", a black water loving mould that grows on cellulose and produces mycotoxins on it's spores, which causes heamoraging of the lungs.

This was the perfect agent to be the cause of the 10th plague, but was only effective in killing the first born due to a combination of cultural factors. Firstly, it only effected the top part of the grain store, and the important people got first servings. Then, Egyptian first born were given an extra helping of the best food, as culturally they were thought of as the most important thing that the family possessed. This resulted in only the first born Egyptians being given a lethal dose of the toxins.

At the same time, the israelites were using different practices for food preparation that didn't concentrate the infected grain into lethal doses. This resulted in no deaths among them.


83 posted on 04/14/2006 2:26:47 PM PDT by anglian
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To: Tokra

I agree, it doesn't make sense. Not only that, if God did use a volcano, then it must have been at least two explosions. Because too much time passed from the first plague to the alleged Tsunami for the sea crossing.

And if it was just a lake then a Tsunami doesn't make much sense either.


99 posted on 04/15/2006 10:15:18 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: Tokra

The first borns dying was explained in the documentary. The first born male egyptians were exalted above all other children. They slept in beds close to the ground whereas other children often slept on the roof. The theory espoused in the documentary based on a similar event that happened somewhere in Africa in the 1980s was that an earthquake caused an underground gas leak to rise to the surface forming a low-lying lethal cloud of gas to kill people that were close to the surface. Like I said above, there was a similar instance of this in Africa in the 1980s in which hundreds of villagers were killed as they slept. The archaeologists also found some mass graves dating back to the same time period as the Exodus (1,500 BC) and all the skeletons in the grave were young males.


133 posted on 08/23/2006 10:22:10 AM PDT by piperpilot
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To: Tokra; SunkenCiv
"...I don't understand how a volcanic eruption could kill the first born of the Egyptians..."

"The biblical story of the last plague has a distinctly supernatural quality in that all the firstborn and only the firstborn were killed on the night of the plague. An earthquake that destroys only the firstborn is inconceivable, because events can never attain that degree of coincidence. No credit should be given to such a record.

Either the story of the last plague, in its canonized form, is a fiction, or it conceals a corruption of the text. Before proclaiming the whole a strange tale interpolated later, it would be wise to inquire whether or not the incredible part alone is corrupted. It may be that 'the firstborn' stands for some other word.

ISAIAH 43:16 Thus saith the Lord, which maketh a way in the sea and a path in the mighty waters: 20...I give waters in the wilderness, and rivers in the desert, to give drink to my people, my chosen.

In the book of Exodus it is said that Moses was commanded:

EXODUS 4:22-23 And thou shalt say onto Pharaoh, This saith the Lord, Israel is my son, even my firstborn....and if thou refuse to let him go, behold I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn. The "chosen" are here called the "firstborn". If Israel was the firstborn, revenge was to be taken against Egypt by the death of its chosen.

"Israel, my chosen", is Israel bechiri, or bechori.

"Israel, my firstborn" is Israel bekhori.

It is the first root which was supposed to determine the relation between God and his people. Therefor: "at midnight the Lord smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt," (Exodus 12:29) must be read "all the select of Egypt," as one would say "all the flower of Egypt".

AGES IN CHAOS, Immanuel Velikovsky.

152 posted on 11/22/2006 2:31:46 PM PST by Fred Nerks (lost my tagline...)
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