Hi andyandmikesmom,
I don't mind talking about personal details. I think it helps us connect as people and tends to personalize the discussion in a positive way. It makes us more than words on a screen. I swear some people treat these threads like a video game, with a eye towards scoring points.
My mom and pop came from different sides of the tracks. My dad's parents were educated, genteel people. My paternal grandmother had an education degree and was a schoolteacher, and my paternal grandfather was an electrical engineer. My mom's side of the family were blue collar, and a little more earthy, and they were proud of their high school diplomas. My maternal grandfather worked his way up from being oil field trash, to owning a machine shop, to owning a oilfield tools company and holding several patents -- all with little formal education.
My folks were always supportive of my decisions. They came to visit me when I graduated from boot camp. It's still one of the most memorable occasions of my life. I don't feel the same way about graduation from high school. I don't believe my high school education prepared me particularly well for life as an adult. It's ironic now I'm interested in electrical engineering. It was my grandpa's field, and I think he'd be pround. He left me a whole lot of books on the subject. It's kind of a hoot reading his old calculus books from the 30s and 40s, because with the exception of pretty graphics in my textbooks, the subject is the same.
It's hard to imagine for me, but I gather from them that in the 1930s when they grew up, having a high school diploma was an feather in your cap and having a university degree was a real accomplishment. It seems to me that having a university degree today is equivalent to having a high school diploma was for them. I can only imagine what the future will be like if we extrapolate into the future. At some point, having a university education will almost be a necessity for most technical jobs and professional positions. It's almost like that today.
Trying to relate this discussion to the topic at hand, this is why I tend to argue on the pro-science side in these debates. Technical and scientific training is only going to become more important for national compeditiveness of the U.S. in the future. I resist any trend to teach culturally-sensitive science. Physics or biology doesn't care if you're Republican or Democrat, Christian or Jew or atheist. In my opinion, teaching science with a mind towards cultural sensitivity is taking technical training in the wrong direction. It waters the subject down. Science class is one of the last bastions of critical thinking and problem solving in school. Science curriculum, therefore, must present the prevailing scientific viewpoint and do so in such a way to develop problem-solving skills.
Ah, that was great, the stories of your family....I too, like stories about people and their families, I believe, like you, this stories and histories, make us seem all the more human to each other, rather just some random person we are conversing with via the internet...now, some posters do not like to reveal anything about themselves, and thats fine too...but I enjoy hearing about other peoples families, their histories, and their lives...and I, being a blabber mouth, like to talk about mine...
I agree completely with what you say, in your last paragraph...Physics, biology, any true science, does not care anything for your politics, or your religion...it should be outside of those considerations...I agree it is in science where critical thinking, and problem solving should be able to operate, regardless of ones political leanings, or particular religious affiliation, or lack of personal religious belief...
What really irritates me, most of all, is when scientific matters, are decided by some, only in light of what they perceive that God seems to be saying to them, literally from the Bible..they never allow that other folks can read the same passages, and get a whole other valuable meaning..those folks never, ever will admit that how they read the Bible, is only their own personal interpretion, rather than the absolute Word of God...those who claim they are 'speaking' for God, are to my mind, the ones who are least likely to to actually have the great 'faith', that they claim they have...thats just my own opinion...
Anyway, I do suppose, that this Crevo debate will continue to continue...I never really expect it to end....
Ah, time for me to leave soon, time to color Easter Eggs(gosh, I hope no one runs onto this thread, and just has to tell me that coloring eggs for Easter is such a pagan act, and I will be condemned for it)...