In Honor of Harry Browne, the Libertarian Party Statement of Principles.

LP.org

[jim_trent]

> How about actually trying it here?

Because there is not a majority in this country who believe in personal responsibility. That is why things are going like they are now. That is also why Libertarians wanted to move to a small state and take it over. They could try their ideas and, if they worked, point it out to skeptics (which I am one). I am just wondering what happened with that plan.

Actually, I don't think Libertarians could agree on anything long enough to change a lighbulb, but I am willing to see if they can dempnstrate they are right.

[Capitalism2003]

" ... We hold that all individuals have the right to exercise sole dominion over their own lives, and have the right to live in whatever manner they choose, so long as they do not forcibly interfere with the equal right of others to live in whatever manner they choose ... " My children went through that stage when they were growing up. After several lessons they were cured.

"A wise and frugal government which shall restrain men from injuring one another, which shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government." – Thomas Jefferson (1801)

All I can say is, thank GOD that our founders weren't 'cured of these "childish" beliefs...

[G.Mason]

If you believe those two statements say the same thing, then may God bless you.

[Capitalism2003]

I believe that every individual is naturally entitled to do as he pleases with himself and the fruits of his labor, so far as it in no way interferes with any other men's rights. – Abraham Lincoln

The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg. – Thomas Jefferson (1781)

The care of every man's soul belongs to himself. But what if he neglect the care of it? Well what if he neglect the care of his health or his estate, which would more nearly relate to the state. Will the magistrate make a law that he not be poor or sick? Laws provide against injury from others; but not from ourselves. God himself will not save men against their wills. – Thomas Jefferson

The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits. – Thomas Jefferson

There are more instances of the abridgement of the freedom of the people by the gradual and silent encroachment of those in power, than by violent and sudden usurpation. – James Madison

Do not separate text from historical background. If you do, you will have perverted and subverted the Constitution, which can only end in a distorted, bastardized form of illegitimate government. – James Madison

[Capitalism2003]

Actually, the LP doesn't have an "open border" stance. They believe in unrestricted LEGAL immigration, with very harsh enforcement of illegal immigration, which poses a grave security threat to the country. If you want to come in to work, fine...Go through a background check and all of the proper procedures and you are welcome. Everybody coming here for another reason should be stopped cold.

[freepatriot32]

ping

[traviskicks]

Libertarian ping! To be added or removed from my ping list freepmail me or post a message here.

[JTN]

My children went through that stage when they were growing up. After several lessons they were cured.

Proving the truth of the statement, "Liberals want the government to be your Mommy. Conservatives want government to be your Daddy. Libertarians want it to treat you like an adult."

[JTN]

We hold that morality is irrelevant to a functioning society -- religion, faith, morality, and virtue are optional (and keep it to yourself, thank you).

Straw men, however, are a necessity.

[LibertarianInExile]

"They believe in unrestricted LEGAL immigration, with very harsh enforcement of illegal immigration, which poses a grave security threat to the country."

I would like to see where that is stated. I'm not sure I agree from what I've seen of the LP. Additionally, it's my understanding the LP has stated that its platform is inseparable--that is, all of it is top priority, and you don't have to reduce the welfare state before initiating unrestricted legal immigration. Is that your understanding? If you have a different spin on that, I'd be happy to see where the LP disagreed.

[LibertarianInExile]

"Slip of the tongue? Do you really think so, given the meaning of the word and the context in which it was used?"

Why don't you look up the word "reign" and see if it fits into the idiom "rain on your parade," before you go further into an etymological discussion? While I'm sure it's entertaining for most libertarians to watch you further embarrass yourself, I cringe at your unwitting and continued exposure of your ignorance, and want to help you stop digging the hole. Perhaps if you realize that in a free society, people still do good without the guiding hand of mommy & daddy, or nanny states, you'll be on the road to realizing that American government doesn't have to be big and powerful for America to be great.

Protecting the rights of even the least individual among us is basically the only excuse the government has for even existing. - Ronald Reagan

[mugs99]

No, but it only works with responsible people

"The American heritage was one of individual liberty, personal responsibility and freedom from government. Unfortunately, that heritage has been lost. Americans no longer have the freedom to direct their own lives. Today, it is the government that is "free” free to do whatever it wants. There is no subject, no issue, no matter that is not subject to legislation."...Harry Browne
.

[dcwusmc]

Please explain how, in your view, they differ substantially.

[G.Mason]

Jeffersons words ..."otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement" ... specifically relate to hard work (industry) and making ones self better. (improvement)

The quote, taken from the Libertarian Party Statement of Principles ...

" We hold that all individuals have the right to exercise sole dominion over their own lives, and have the right to live in whatever manner they choose, so long as they do not forcibly interfere with the equal right of others to live in whatever manner they choose "

... has no such wording and indicates man should be allowed to live socially with others in any manner of his choosing.

Hardly a recipe for a successful United States.

[dcwusmc]

"...has no such wording and indicates man should be allowed to live socially with others in any manner of his choosing."

You left out two importand (and STRNGLY IMPLIED) words: "...in any PEACEABLE and RESPONSIBLE manner of his choosing." As none if the L/libertarians I ever knew was a fan of the welfare state, nor a strong fan of total anarchy, those two words are ALWAYS implied when discussing topics such as this. Further, Jeffersons words can EQUALLY be construed to cover living socially amongst others in a peaceable and responsible manner of one's own choosing, a MARVELOUS recipe for a successful United States or any OTHER nation.

Bear in mind that when the Founders signed off on the Declaration of Independence, they specifically used the phrase, "...consent of the governed." The Constitution implements that consent. BUT one cannot give consent to ANYONE, be it his neighbor or his congresscritter, to do something in his name or on his behalf, that HE DOES NOT ALREADY HAVE THE LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY TO DO FOR HIMSELF. Remember, they were in essence saying that the government was the AGENT of We, the People. And an agent can do NOTHING his principal cannot properly do. This is where a lot of conservatives fall down. You have a strong tendency to want to have government RULE us and that is utterly anathema to the free society/Constitutional Republic handed us by the Founders. That is why we are in such a mess today. Read my tagline.