Posted on 03/01/2006 4:43:07 AM PST by SJackson
An evangelical pastor and an Orthodox rabbi, both from Texas, have apparently persuaded leading Baptist preacher Jerry Falwell that Jews can get to heaven without being converted to Christianity.
Televangelist John Hagee and Rabbi Aryeh Scheinberg, whose Cornerstone Church and Rodfei Sholom congregations are based in San Antonio, told The Jerusalem Post that Falwell had adopted Hagee's innovative belief in what Christians refer to as "dual covenant" theology.
This creed, which runs counter to mainstream evangelism, maintains that the Jewish people has a special relationship to God through the revelation at Sinai and therefore does not need "to go through Christ or the Cross" to get to heaven.
Scheinberg said this has been Hagee's position for the 25 years the two have worked together on behalf of Israel and that Falwell had also come to accept it. Falwell sent a representative to the San Antonio launch of Christians United for Israel in early February, as did popular televangelist Pat Robertson.
Hagee, who will serve as CUFI national chairman, says the new organization aims to be a kind of "Christian AIPAC" (American Israel Public Affairs Committee) through which every pro-Israel Christian organization and ministry in America can speak and act with one voice in support of Israel on biblical issues.
The main issue, following disengagement from the Gaza Strip, is not to give up any more of the Land of Israel, he said.
Many Christian denominational leaders - who represent some 30 million evangelical Christians in the US - have expressed support for CUFI in writing. These include such names as Dr. Jack Hayford, president of the Foursquare Gospel Church; Paul Walker, assistant general overseer of the Church of God; international Pastor Rod Parsley of the World Harvest Church; Benny Hinn; George Morrison; Kenneth Copland; Steve Strang; Matt Croutch of the Trinity Broadcasting Network; and former presidential candidate Gary Bauer, president of the Family Research Council.
The latter is the Washington-based lobbying arm of James Dobson's Focus on the Family.
Scheinberg said he had worked with Hagee since 1981, when the pastor first broached the idea of organizing a night to honor Israel, which has become an annual event.
"He came to the Jewish community and of course they were skeptical, they were a bit suspicious, anxious about whatever agenda he might have," the rabbi recalled. "He took public positions against proselytizing the Jews, which some of his own colleagues at that time criticized him roundly for; for example, Falwell was at that time very critical of his nonconversionary statements regarding the Jews. But that's not the case now though. Falwell has changed his position," he said.
Hagee has been consistent in this theological position, Scheinberg said, and this was reflected in both the declared policy of CUFI and at the public launch of the organization last month.
"It seemed there was a great deal of unity - not unanimity - on nonconversion, a nonproselytizing agenda, that the Jews have a special covenant, and this was stated over and over," the rabbi said.
"It was stated in Hagee's opening speech, in his opening statement, and then repeated again. And when there was a question period later, no one asked about this. It seemed to be understood that any hidden agenda, any attempt at conversion, would undermine all their efforts, would be counterproductive, and that's not what they are about.
"There was always concern on the part of the Jewish community that there's a hidden agenda now, to convert now, to proselytize now. And regarding that, Hagee was very strong in saying no, we are not proselytizing," Scheinberg said.
Scheinberg, the only rabbi at the CUFI launch, senses there has been a downplaying of traditional evangelical theology in favor of something more concrete - supporting Israel. He associates this phenomenon of "Christian Zionism" with God's promise in Genesis 12:3 that those who bless Israel will be blessed and those who curse Israel will be cursed.
"The reason that I was at the summit was that I've been with him since the very beginning. It's not because I was Orthodox. I'm sure on other occasions he would be happy to invite the Conservatives. The Reform here have been very vocal in their opposition to anything that Hagee does - not so much for his support of Israel, but because the fundamentalist agenda, social agenda, is quite different than the Reform liberal agenda, and particularly Hagee's position on gay rights, on abortion, on pornography, etc., etc., run contrary or are anathema to some of the positions of the very liberal Reform," he said.
Falwell has altered his position, according to Scheinberg, apparently because the pastor decided to put End of Days theology aside in favor of the overriding need to support Israel, particularly against the mounting threat of a nuclear Iran.
"Obviously Falwell was very passionate about conversion, but he absolutely clearly knows Hagee's position and the Christians United for Israel position," Scheinberg said. "No question about that; Hagee assured me. I would trust him in his role for Israel, for Israel's security, to strengthen Israel. I would be very surprised if Falwell ever tried to pull a fast one. Morrison, Bauer and Hagee are so strong and so clear in their nonconversionary position, as well as the organization. Unless he [Falwell] lapsed into a moment of stupidity," Scheinberg said.
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The New Testament does not teach what Hagee and Falwell may now support. But if they are right, God would be making some kind of dispensation for Jewish people. I suspect that Falwell is doing this to show his support for Israel, but deep down I know he must have reservations. He is probably thinking, "Maybe I have been wrong all these years, and I will turn over the Jewish question to God." I will still listen to the weekly Falwell message, for he is biblically-based. Similarly, Billy Graham made a foolish statement in the 1980s about there being "religious freedom" in the old Soviet Union. Many disagreed, but they did not brand the popular Mr. Graham an outright heretic.
Right you are. What they are teaching is in direct contradiction of scripture.
But if they are right, God would be making some kind of dispensation for Jewish people.
I think I'll stick with scripture over Falwell and Hagee.
I suspect that Falwell is doing this to show his support for Israel, but deep down I know he must have reservations.
I'm all in favor of supporting Israel...presenting a false gospel of salvation is not in the best interests of Jews or anyone else. If he has reservations he shouldn't be teaching a false gospel at all.
I will still listen to the weekly Falwell message, for he is biblically-based.
He's just proved that at least some of his teachings are NOT Biblically based.
Similarly, Billy Graham made a foolish statement in the 1980s about there being "religious freedom" in the old Soviet Union. Many disagreed, but they did not brand the popular Mr. Graham an outright heretic.
2 points here, firstly, making an inaccurate statement regarding religious freedom in the Soviet Union is not the same as presenting a false gospel of salvation. Secondly, the acceptability of false teachings from Falwell and Hagee are not impacted by correct or incorrect statements by Graham. As an aside, I've seen quotes from Graham that are of much greater concern than a poor grasp of the situation within the Soviet Union from Graham...although it's possible that his present illness has compromised his clarity.
Yep.
There was an old testament, an old covenant in effect.
That was superceded by the new testatment, the new covenant.
covenant = contract here.
Under the terms of the new contract, there is only one Way.
The good news (gospel) is that now salvation is available, freely given, to ALL, not just the Jews.
Absolutely. It's a nonnegotiable within Christianity. The Bible doesn't beat about the bush on this.
You are absolutely right in all of your points. I think that Falwell was ramrodded by fellow supporters of Israel into making that statement. I really wonder if he agrees with it, but you are right: that is heresy no matter the motivation.
Sure they can get to heaven, through faith in the Messiah. I know lots of heaven bound Jews! There's a congregation full of them down the street.
If this is true, Falwell is following the path of Vendyl Jones and some other former Christian clergy who held some 'dual covenant' beliefs on their way to becoming straightforward Noahides.
I expect Falwell to issue cloudy 'clarifications', however, and deny this version of his beliefs.
It is a pleasure to discuss topics with someone who is rational and not tied up in personal pride. I certainly don't know what inspired or ramrodded him into such anti-Bibilical statements, but I do hope that those who have his ear take him aside and discuss it with him. God bless you brother.
One would think so. This seems to be related to their new political organization.
Oh, please. It's debatable whether Jews even believe in Heaven. And why the hell should Jews care what Evangelicals think??
Baptist ping
I didn't read the article closely, but I didn't see a direct quote from Falwell. I would refrain judgement on him until he actually speaks for himself. All I saw was other people speaking for him.
And why the hell should Jews care what Evangelicals think??
You answered your own question!!
"This creed, which runs counter to mainstream evangelism, maintains that the Jewish people has a special relationship to God through the revelation at Sinai and therefore does not need "to go through Christ or the Cross" to get to heaven."
My question would be this: If one does not need Christ or the Cross to get to heaven, then what are they to expect when they get there? When they see Christ sitting at the right hand of God, Judging the nations and deeds of every man, will they say "we don't need you?"
Orthodoxy would humbly claim that we know where the church is, but we do not know where it is not. But to this, those who have never heard of Christ will have the opportunity to meet their creator and will have the ability to hear the voice of the Shepard, which they will either recognize or not. But I would not put my eggs into a basket of rejecting Him outright in this life and then expect to somehow recognize Him at the day of Judgment.
When Christ came He was the "I AM" from Sinai. When Christ came to the Jews there were many that hailed Him as the Messiah, and many that did not. Those that did were true Children of Abraham with faith in the hearts. It was this faith that allowed them to see Christ and it was this faith that brought to reality the promise of God's covenant. Those Jews that were able to see Christ as the Son of God became Christians as the fruit of their faith. Those that did not forsook the covenant and did not have faith nor did they see Christ in this life.
When Christ descended into Hades during His three days in the tomb, it was a living faith, by those who died before Him (OT), and the ability to recognize the Messiah that brought the captive to everlasting life. Those that did not recognize Him remained in Hades for they refused to follow Him in this life and in the Life to come.
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