Posted on 02/26/2006 7:55:05 AM PST by Wolfie
Physician Advocates for Medical Marijuana
Vermont -- As he opened his remarks about medical marijuana, Dr. Joseph McSherry said he couldn't be as informative as he would like to be.
"I asked a very good friend, who happens to be a medical marijuana patient, what I should tell you today," McSherry said. "He said to tell you not to ask a doctor. Doctors don't know (expletive) about medical marijuana."
McSherry, a neurophysiologist and PhD associated with Fletcher Allen Medical Center and the University of Vermont, said his friend is largely correct: There have been few scientific studies on the effects of marijuana as a medicine, and even less research has been conducted on its medical effects in humans.
"You'll probably be more educated than your doctor by the time we get through," McSherry told his audience at the Godnick Center in Rutland on Friday.
He walked the audience through the limited medical data on cannabis and the properties of the chemicals in marijuana other than THC that can have beneficial effects.
Canabanoids, McSherry said, can boost the effectiveness of other painkillers, inhibit the growth of tumors and alleviate wet macular degeneration, which causes blindness in some cases.
"We're just beginning to scratch the surface of this iceberg," he said.
McSherry said that inhaled marijuana can be very effective at treating sudden swift pains, while many other painkillers, including marinol — a legal prescription drug that is a capsule of THC in sesame oil — can take too long to take effect.
"I don't approve of smoking for anybody," he said. "There's got to be a better way of doing it, but the U.S. government hasn't been interested in doing any research.
"If you eat it, the chemicals peak in two to four hours. Eating it is probably the worst way of intaking THC," he said. "If you inhale it, THC levels peak in a few minutes and it actually goes away in the first hour."
He noted that researchers in other countries are trying to develop different types of medical cannabis for patients.
Two members of the audience who said they use the drug for medicinal purposes offered compelling testimony about its benefits. Neither identified themselves.
The first patient said that at one point he had been on 17 different medications to treat his multiple sclerosis — some to counteract the side effects of other medications.
"Now I think I'm on four medications now," he said. "I'm not on medications for the side effects of medication. I'm not drugged out or high. From 17 meds, down to four."
A second patient said he had lost more than 50 pounds while undergoing chemotherapy before using marijuana to counteract the nausea.
"I went from 236 pounds down to 176," he said. "Part of the problem was the sickness of chemo. I couldn't hold down food, and marinol did not work for me. Cannabis did work."
Members of the audience had many questions about medical marijuana, from its chemical properties to the intricacies of growing plants to use for medicine.
"If you have a seed that has a known history of consistent product, you will get a consistent product medically," McSherry said. "That's why I think patients ought to be able to grow their own."
One audience member wondered how patients who don't grow it can access medical marijuana.
"Where does the pot come from if you're not a green thumb person?" she asked.
McSherry said "compassionate clubs" have formed in California that allow medical marijuana patients to bring in prescriptions to be filled with marijuana of a known quality rather than forcing patients to rely on what they can find on the black market, he said.
"In Vermont, if you have a friend or a grandson … you can make a provision to register with the state that you're a registered patient and they're a registered grower," he said, adding that Vermont's medical marijuana law does not shield users or growers from federal prosecution.
McSherry sees access to the drug as an uphill battle. He said many doctors are resistant to the notion of medical marijuana.
"There are very definitely a lot of doctors who are very adamant it's not a medicine," he said. "There are doctors that believe if it were a medicine, the FDA would approve it and pharmaceutical companies would make cannabis that you can take as a product.
"But patients' definition of a medicine is a different thing," he added.
That sounds like the start of a medical trial.... It might be time to start a full fledged trial.
Are you speaking from experience? I have seen people pass out and I know it is difficult to drive.
I am on your side, but I think it might be helpful to get better data on the subject.
http://www.cannabis.net/withdrawal/index.html
Withdrawal symptoms following cessation of heavy cannabis (marijuana) use have been reported, yet their time course and clinical importance have not been established. A 50-day outpatient study assessed 18 marijuana users during a 5-day smoking-as-usual phase followed by a 45-day abstinence phase. Parallel assessment of 12 ex-users was obtained. A withdrawal pattern was observed for aggression, anger, anxiety, decreased appetite, decreased body weight, irritability, restlessness, shakiness, sleep problems, and stomach pain. Onset typically occurred between Days 1-3, peak effects between Days 2-6, and most effects lasted 4-14 days. The magnitude and time course of these effects appeared comparable to tobacco and other withdrawal syndromes. These effects likely contribute to the development of dependence and difficulty stopping use. Criteria for cannabis withdrawal are proposed.
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One reason that cannabis withdrawal is not noted more is the fact that the chemicals are fat soluble and linger in the body for some time- so when cannabis ingestion is suddenly stopped, the cannabis built up in the body slowly decreases, greatly softening withdrawal symptoms.
Opiates are mostly water soluble and have a much shorter biological half-life. When you stop ingesting heroin, it is gone from your body much faster and the withdrawal symptoms are readily apparent.
CANNABIS: WITHDRAWAL AND TREATMENT
Withdrawal
Abrupt termination of cannabis use can produce a mild withdrawal syndrome. Symptoms include sleep disturbance, irritability, loss of appetite and consequent weight loss, nervousness, anxiety, sweating and upset stomach. Sometimes chills, increased body temperature and tremors occur. The withdrawal syndrome usually lasts for less than a week, although the sleep disturbances may persist for a longer period.
http://www.mydr.com.au/default.asp?article=2919
Yeah, as is my definition of a medical marijuana patient.
Do you know this from firsthand experience?
I do, and that is way off the mark. No symptoms whatsoever.
Another big lie.
http://www.health.nsw.gov.au/public-health/dpb/supplements/supp10.pdf
This lists cannabis withdrawal symptoms, and declares them to be mild and not dangerous medically.
The article mentions effects on the large airway structures and compares these with the effects of tobacco, which effects the small airways like the alveoli. Chronic bronchitis is common to pot smokers, according to the article.
The biggest concern seems to be the effects on motivation, especially among the adolescent.
So we can dismiss all this since a government published it. It can't be valid.
I have never seen anyone pass out just from MJ use alone. If they mix it with alcohol or some other drug maybe. But who is to say they wouldn't have passed out just from the alcohol or the other drug all by itself?
I don't use it anymore. Stopped 30 years ago. But I used it long enough to figure out that all the bad things said about MJ were lies. I have seen no concrete proof to indicate anything else.
"It is suggested that the studies conducted to date do not provide a strong evidence base for the drawing of any conclusions as to the existence of a cannabis withdrawal syndrome in human users, or as to the cause of symptoms reported by those abstaining from the drug. On the basis of current research, cannabis cannot be said to provide as clear a withdrawal pattern as other drugs of abuse, such as opiates. However, cannabis also highlights the need for a further defining of withdrawal, in particular the position that rebound effects occupy in this phenomenon. It is concluded that more controlled research might uncover a diagnosable withdrawal syndrome in human users and that there may be a precedent for the introduction of a cannabis withdrawal syndrome before the exact root of it is known" (Smith 2002).
Tolerance and rebound phenomena in humans have been described for cannabis. These are other indications of dependency caused by cannabis:
"Tolerance develops to the receptor-mediated effects of THC with continued usage. However, there are distinctions in their degree with different effects. Discontinuation of chronic THC use may cause rebound phenomena (transient increase in intraocular pressure, loss of appetite, etc.). Some chronic users report withdrawal symptoms after abrupt cessation. This withdrawal syndrome is characterized by irritability, agitation, sleep disorder, hyperhidrosis and loss of appetite. It is generally mild. Cannabis dependency is less determined by physical than by psychological factors. Dependency and abuse potential of therapeutically employed D9-THC is low" (Grotenhermen 2002).
http://www.drugscience.org/pt/cc14.htm
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Withdrawal and dependence are not as bad with cannabis as compared to other drugs, but it is there, can't be ignored.
Which maybe explains why the pharmaceuticals are not interested in investing tens of millions of dollars into marijuana research.
Or it could be a government conspiracy.
Here is what Hitler said about lies:
"The size of the lie is a definite factor in causing it to be believed, for the vast masses of the nation are in the depths of their hearts more easily deceived than they are consciously and intentionally bad. The primitive simplicity of their minds renders them a more easy prey to a big lie than a small one, for they themselves often tell little lies but would be ashamed to tell a big one."
"All propaganda must be so popular and on such an intellectual level, that even the most stupid of those towards whom it is directed will understand it. Therefore, the intellectual level of the propaganda must be lower the larger the number of people who are to be influenced by it."
Think whatever you want to. I have been there, done that and I know there are no withdrawal symptoms from quitting MJ.
And what symptoms did you have when you quit? Oh, you have zero experience but you have all the answers?
Keep on swallowing the big lie.
Yep, toss it right out if you disagree.
I think we need to allow cannabis research again in the USA. Best way to go.
MAPS got approval to try MDMA in post-stress syndrome cases, so that's a plus.
Did you catch the SCOTUS action on hoasaca last week? They are going to allow UDV to use it until the trial- which is a trial brought by UDV against the government, not the other way around, and it's clear that the government wanted it that way, so that UDV can make its case.
TOBACCO ........................ 400,000
ALCOHOL ........................ 100,000
CAFFEINE ....................... 2,000
ASPIRIN ........................ 500
ALL LEGAL DRUGS ................ 20,000
"400,000 + 100,000 + 2,000 + 500 = 20,000"
Whether products of incompetence or fabrication, these numbers are as worthless as the government that produced them, and the lives of the addicts who kid themselves in their publication.
Same with me, I stopped MANY years ago. Don't you remember everyone just sitting around, spaced out? The laughing jags? But from what I hear, mj has gotten much more powerful in its affects these days. Plus is mj even popular anymore? Don't even know if there is still a market out there for it? I think "designer" drugs are more popular now. Now that is scarey stuff!
They had to wait for all the laughter to die down from their "Smoke pot and you're funding terrorists" ads.
Those are some good ideas.
ping
I know it used to cost $20 per oz. when I smoked it but now the price has skyrocketed. I see on some threads they mention over $400 per oz. Ouch!
I remember laughing like crazy the first few times I smoked it but after that hardly at all. But the first few times I couldn't stop laughing.
As for the stength, we used to get some pretty powerful stuff from Columbia, Panama, Thailand, Vietnam, etc. Soldiers would bring it home with them, and sailors too. I can't see the stuff today being any more powerful than what we used to get. And I guess low-grade Mexican is still low-grade Mexican.
I have no idea how popular it is anymore. I wonder that myself.
But I'm sure that there will always be a market for it. Just by being illegal it makes certain people have to try it.
The War on Drugs is a panacea like those which began it in the first place. It is sold by hucksters as a cure to the ills of the nations at the same time it robs him of his cash and provides him with a greater ill which robs him of his liberty.
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