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To: MamaTexan
Point of order here Mama.

1. Thomas Jefferson didn't have any part in writing the Constitution --- he was in France through it's entire drafting and ratification.

2. Jefferson was opposed to ratification. He was the de-facto leader of the anti-Federalist faction.

3. Your Madison quote is very nice and also very true. The Federal power was defined and limited. But I fail to see how you can construe Madison's words as saying that the states can simply ignore at their pleasure the "defined and limited" powers of the Federal government.

BTW. You still have not told us what "unconstitutional" actions the Federal government took that drove 7 of the 11 southern states to trash the Constitution months before Lincoln even took office. Was it something the Buchanan administration did? ;~))

Here's another Jefferson quote for you.

Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government...

That's commonly referred to as the Right to Revolution when faced with intolerable oppression. Can you list the intolerable abuses the south faced in the months following Lincoln's election that gave them the moral Right to Revolution? None of the Confederate documents from that era ever enumerated those abuses as Jefferson did 4 score and 5 years eariler.
207 posted on 02/22/2006 4:40:43 PM PST by Ditto
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To: Ditto
But I fail to see how you can construe Madison's words as saying that the states can simply ignore at their pleasure the "defined and limited" powers of the Federal government.

I didn't say they could. I said They had a right to ignore illegitimate actions of the federal government

----

Can you list the intolerable abuses the south faced in the months following Lincoln's election that gave them the moral Right to Revolution?

It wasn't a revolution. A revolution is an attempt to overthrow a government. The Southern states were just trying to leave.

----

None of the Confederate documents from that era ever enumerated those abuses as Jefferson did 4 score and 5 years earlier.

Yes they did. I posted it already in #179.

215 posted on 02/22/2006 5:56:25 PM PST by MamaTexan (I am NOT a ~legal entity~, nor am I a *person* as created by law!)
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To: Ditto

I have seen no evidence that Jefferson actually opposed ratification and doubt Washington would have put him in Cabinet if he had. I am fairly sure he would have had he been in the country. Thank God he was not.


230 posted on 02/22/2006 8:03:51 PM PST by justshutupandtakeit (Public Enemy #1, the RATmedia.)
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