Posted on 02/15/2006 11:27:15 AM PST by Jeremiah2911
Why does Islam have to reform?...I thought it was already
the religion of peace?
ping
good read.
I vote for #3.
The majority of Muslim-Americans live in the 21st Century. The countries they come from live in the 12th Century. It's up to them to REFORM.
Islam needs reform to adjust to the reality of the modern world. However, as much as 70% of moslems don't want reform but want the west to go away.
We waged total war on Germany and Japan, but we never had a policy of trying to kill all Germans and Japanese. We fought their governments, and when they were destroyed the war was over.
This war is a lot more difficult, as there is no government to target. But I don't think I'll ever be ready for total war that has the killing of over 1B people as its objective. There's no question we have the ability to do it. I'm just not sure that I want to support or remain a part of the society that would do such a thing.
It's either them or us. I vote for us to survive.
There's no way for democracy and islam to co-exist - they are fundementally unable to exist within one another. It truly is them or us.
Define "them" and I might agree with you.
I'll take what's behind door #3 Monty.
That is asking them to give up their religion for worldly gain, and to accomodate the Infidels. Not likely to work.
The plane hijackers had the worldly goods, They gave their lives up for the religion. They had good earthly lives,money education family etc.
Multi millionaire Osama bin Laden had it all, and he gave it up to fight the Infidels . Many well to do suicide bombers came from Saudi Arabia into Iraq and other places, and they gave their lives fighting the Infidel for the belief that paradise would be theirs.
Given a choice between paradise or worldly things, or doing Allah's work on earth;..... killing the Infidel, and the Muslim heretics who collaborate with the Infidel scum, will be the choice of the Muslim believers who follow the dictates of the Koran and the Hadiths.
You are not going to buy them of with an offer of an alternative lifestyle. - tom
Will happen when Muslims like Muqtedar Khan become influential leaders in the Muslim world. Though he is reputed to be a vocal critic of Bush's foreign policy, he defends America's role in the world.
He reminded Europe of its double standards. As he puts it: 'Compared to Europe's history American colonial ambitions are insignificant and as far as democracy and freedom of religion was concerned the US was streets ahead of the French ... I reminded them that the US was, as former Secretary of State Albright pointed out, the "indispensable nation".
His allegiance to America leads Khan to delineate the kind of role that American Muslims ought to play as citizens of that country. Writing in the New York Times, he sets the context of his thesis by emphasising that 9/11 has been a traumatic experience for American Muslims. They now face 'hostility and prejudice in many corners of society'. Yet, this traumatic experience also provides a window of opportunity to reconstruct the identity of American Muslims. Some positive changes are underway, such as endowments to fund Islamic Studies in American Universities, but a lot more needs to be done. As he puts it: 'We need to ... demonstrate that Muslims in this country constitute an ethical and philanthropic community that cares about humanitarian causes, about America and Americans and stands for justice and rights as embodied in the Constitution.'
He reminds fellow Americans that there are mutual obligations. 'They cannot allow events overseas to foster anti-Muslim sentiments and Islamophobia at home'. Ultimately, Khan sees a reconstructed American Muslim identity in which '...Muslims must realise that the interests of our sons and daughters, who are American, must come before the interests of our brothers and sisters, whether they are Palestinian, Kashmiri or Iraqi'.
Of interest via Wikipedia: Liberal movements within Islam
First the American people will have to be outraged, another attack will do it hopefully. Of course another attack may just give Dems chances to blame Bush, and call for a different approach.
Now that I write that, I am depressed. It is obvious what would dominate the news. Although the masses would want revenge, the media would call for thoughtful responses.
I am sorry, but our only hope is their total annilihation, they have proven that through actions and lack there of.
"Them": Those who would forcibly attack or threaten others so as to impose their beliefs as the only ones allowed in the public sphere, and those who would fight to retain that power.
If a "kill 'em all" battle begins, those mystical, mythical "Moderate Muslims" have the same choice as the rest of us: fight for those who want to impose Islam as the superior faith, fight for those who oppose such subjugation, or sit quietly on the sidelines and pray (to whomever you wish) that the bullets and bombs don't come your way.
The tough part is figuring out who is on which team, especially since they're making asymmetrial warfare an art form... honesty, bravery in the field, targeting only enemy combatants, fighting in plain uniform to avoid loss of innocent life, etc. are all going to be taken off the table for this one, for at least one side... and I don't see "our" side maintaining it's more righteous positions on those matters for too many years if the battle is at all unsure.
A muslim cannot both remain true to his scriptures and be appeased or reformed. That leaves us option #3.
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