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To: thomaswest
In fact, every individual is a product of quasi-random events.

Perhaps. But perhaps not. There is no way to determine if what happens in the world is random or guided. That cannot be answered scientifically.

(Unless, of course, one takes the view that each egg and sperm were individually directed by God. Nobody in biology would accept this, but as a matter of faith, it is unprovable.)

Why would nobody in science accept that idea? Is there some reason not to? I agree that it is unprovable but it shows that scientists are starting from some basic presumptions that are not neutral.

My objection to random chance is that there is no way of supporting the statement. It is just the opinion of scientists that it is true and that things are unguided. What is the evo objection to the idea that it's guided?

150 posted on 02/13/2006 9:36:27 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

####What is the evo objection to the idea that it's guided?####

It does seem to disturb quite a few of them! :-)


151 posted on 02/13/2006 9:39:19 PM PST by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: metmom
Unless, of course, one takes the view that each egg and sperm were individually directed by God. Nobody in biology would accept this, but as a matter of faith, it is unprovable.

Why would nobody in science accept that idea? Is there some reason not to? I agree that it is unprovable but it shows that scientists are starting from some basic presumptions that are not neutral.

You may chose to believe that every raindrop and snowflake is individually directed by a god of rain, but I don't think you will find many supporters in either Christian belief or in science. Your argument leads to "every molecule of the air we breathe is individually determined by a god; every molecule of water we drink being directed. By your argument, there would never be such a thing as chance or randomness. Sorry, you cannot escape by defining randomness out of existence.

Perhaps you are a Calvinist who believes everything is pre-determined by a Great Sky God, and every sperm and raindrop is pre-determined? I think many Popes and Martin Luther would dispute you.

My objection to random chance is that there is no way of supporting the statement. It is just the opinion of scientists that it is true and that things are unguided. What is the evo objection to the idea that it's guided?

Because there is no science that can show such a "supernatural involvement". How would you know if a god changed the experinment or students made a mistake? "God told me so" is not a good explanation in medicine or in criminal courts.

How would you show that a psychic did not change the results? How would you show that pixies and demons did not determine the outcome? There is no limit, once you choose gods and "supernatural" interventions.

163 posted on 02/13/2006 10:20:52 PM PST by thomaswest (Just curious)
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