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To: illinoissmith
Yes, but we have evolved conscious thought and reasoning ability.

I often seriously doubt that. But I specifically cited "instincts" rather than "intellect", because in case of a tie, instincts usually win. And all you need is, say a nice big hurricane, and even libertarian-leaning freepers are suddenly squealing for the tribal elders to take care of us.

Sadly, education has been socialized in the West, and what passes for it is largely dysfunctional for this purpose.

I despise western primary and secondary education as much as the next guy--we homeschool. But show me the country where education has allowed a majority to overcome their socialistic impulses. Galt's Gulch doesn't exist.

158 posted on 02/08/2006 2:38:38 AM PST by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: Shalom Israel
I don't expect perfection. Ever. The idea of perfection in this world is a brain trap, always.

With decent education, strong cultural transmission of a tradition of liberty, backed up with technical reasons for the curious, those tribal instincts can be checked quite enough for people to live like civilized human beings, respectful of their neighbors' rights and tolerant of their differences, most of the time. Making this tradition means there will be pull back to it after chaos of the occasional upsets have passed.

As far as Galt's Gulch goes, I've read about half a page of Ayn Rand and couldn't tolerate her prose. Far as I can tell from my husband's reports of the plot and style, her only arguably decent fiction was _The Fountain Head_, and event that seems to be Gogol's _The Portrait_ swiped, bludgeoned to death, injected with the author's personal rape fantasy, and screeched through a megaphone. What remains of Gogol's perceptions probably has some value and probably still shines for some people (yes I'm aware Gogol was Christian, but human truths in good literature speak to those of various philosophical frameworks).

I have no fondness for utopias, libertarian or otherwise. I want a decent democratic republic that ensures basic human rights, so that people can live, feed and shelter their families, and have honest discussions, and build the things they like as they can personally afford to, without maniacs trying to enslave or kill them. I think this is quite possible, because I mostly see it around me, barring a few things like state education, or the Kelo decision. Those things, we can live with for the meanwhile, and we have a framework for fighting them peacefully.
175 posted on 02/08/2006 10:52:52 AM PST by illinoissmith
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