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First duty is to yourself (No duty to retreat)
PITTSBURGH TRIBUNE-REVIEW ^ | February 5, 2006 | Dimitri Vassilaros

Posted on 02/06/2006 11:35:25 AM PST by neverdem

The law says you must act like a coward. In your own home. Even when your life is threatened.

Many states have criminal-friendly "duty to retreat" laws. A victim in his house is mandated to retreat from an attacker until he is cornered. Only then is the prey allowed to use lethal force on the predator. Prosecutors in those states have been known to victimize the victim (such as charging him with manslaughter) who prefers to fire back rather than to back off.

The National Rifle Association has been trying to end the insanity state by state.

Florida came to its senses last year. It enacted a law based on the "Castle Doctrine" -- that one's home is one's castle. A person now is not legally required to be hunted down room by room by an intruder before the victim pulls the trigger. The law allows the victim to shoot back without fear of being prosecuted for being overzealous about protecting his life. And it prohibits criminals from suing their more aggressive victims. All their victims, actually.

"Somebody should not be twice victimized, first by the assailant and then by the legal system trying to destroy his life," says Larry Pratt, executive director of Gun Owners of America, the largest organization representing gun owners after the NRA.

But the Florida law does more.

Car-jackers beware; now one's car is his mobile castle. And better still, if a victim is not in a home or car, now he legally can use deadly force. Sunshine State criminals without a death wish might want to consider career counseling. Or take Horace Greeley's advice to go west. But if they do, they had better hurry.

Wyoming is the latest battleground. The NRA is lobbying there and in 11 other states to repeal duty-to-retreat laws...

(Excerpt) Read more at pittsburghlive.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Florida; US: Pennsylvania; US: Wyoming
KEYWORDS: banglist
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To: stuartcr
One small question Stuart.

If you can read the guys mind well enough to KNOW he's not planning to do you any harm, why don't you just set the items he wants on the porch so he doesn't have to come inside?

If someone is entering your house uninvited, you can be certain they don't have your best interests at heart. Even if they only PLAN to take your money and valuables, plans change, especially in the adrenaline charged environment of a robbery.

If you can cower in a back room where you won't be seen, thats fine. Odds are you won't be hurt, but if you have children or a wife, the time it takes to gather them up and escort them to the cower corner is time you're exposing yourself and them to discovery.

Fear makes people do unexpected and often irrational things, like attack the source of the fear. If the criminal sees you escorting your brood, odds are just as good he's going to attack you as they are he's going to flee.


If you enter my home uninvited, you've signed your death warrant. After I put several .45 caliber holes in your chest and head, I'm going to have a shaking session that keeps me from dialing the phone lasting just long enough to assure you've stopped breathing before I call 911.

My life and my families lives are much more important that any other life on the planet.
41 posted on 02/06/2006 12:43:02 PM PST by Dr.Zoidberg (Mohammedism - Bringing you only the best of the 6th century for fourteen hundred years.)
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To: King Prout

I draw a different line. If I'm not home, the cretin can take whatever he wishes. I have insurance. If I'm home, he dies...not because he is stealing my junk, but because he poses a threat to the safety of myself and my loved ones.

I'm a terrific snap shot. I grew up hunting quail in the chapparal in Southern California. The little chickens take off with a whir of wings, and you have just about a second to take them before they dive into another bush. I rarely missed.

That's why I arm myself with a shotgun, rather than a pistol. My 870 shoots where I think it to shoot. It hits my shoulder ready to fire at what I'm thinking of hitting. I cannot do that with a pistol.


42 posted on 02/06/2006 12:43:08 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: tx_eggman

I guess, I should just go out and kill the guy that speeds and cuts me off on the highway too, because 20 miles down the road, he may run into someone?

Yes, I kill poisonous snakes. Most thieves, if not armed, will do what you tell them, if you have a weapon trained on them.


43 posted on 02/06/2006 12:44:33 PM PST by stuartcr (Everything happens as God wants it to.....otherwise, things would be different.)
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To: Cobra64

"Not me. Too cumbersome. Buy a Sig P226 .40 S&W with laser grips. Much more effective at short range."

Not so, by any means. See my message above. I would choose any scattergun for home defense over any handgun. Period.


44 posted on 02/06/2006 12:44:56 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Beckwith

Maryland is one.


45 posted on 02/06/2006 12:46:55 PM PST by Frankss
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To: Dr.Zoidberg

That is ridiculous. Did you read anything I wrote?


46 posted on 02/06/2006 12:47:11 PM PST by stuartcr (Everything happens as God wants it to.....otherwise, things would be different.)
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To: stuartcr
I should just go out and kill the guy that speeds and cuts me off on the highway too, because 20 miles down the road, he may run into someone?

LOL! You're funny.
47 posted on 02/06/2006 12:48:23 PM PST by Dr.Zoidberg (Mohammedism - Bringing you only the best of the 6th century for fourteen hundred years.)
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To: stuartcr
That's the way it should be. I would never shoot anyone inside my home if he were just stealing something and not presenting a danger to life.

Yep. Sure did.
48 posted on 02/06/2006 12:49:32 PM PST by Dr.Zoidberg (Mohammedism - Bringing you only the best of the 6th century for fourteen hundred years.)
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To: stuartcr; MineralMan

you are correct... we are different: I know what money is.

my next TV, when I get around to it, shall cost about $2,000.00USD

call that 250 working hours spent to aquire that sum (minus Uncle's cut).

call that five weeks of my productive life, gone, essentially enslaved to the whim of a thief.

when a man breaks into my home and enslaves me, he becomes a tyrant and loses all claims to a right to my sufferance of his existence.

death to such a tyrant.

so should it ever be for tyrants.


49 posted on 02/06/2006 12:50:01 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: Dr.Zoidberg

And the part about my .44 trained on him? If there is no threat to life, I won't shoot..as I said, the cost of repair, cleanup, and legal fees, would not be worth what he was stealing.


50 posted on 02/06/2006 12:51:15 PM PST by stuartcr (Everything happens as God wants it to.....otherwise, things would be different.)
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To: neverdem

actually in law school we were taught there is no duty to retreat INSIDE your home. Castle doctrine. You do not surrender your castle.

But when did the law ever hinder the left.


51 posted on 02/06/2006 12:54:13 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE!)
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To: MineralMan

I'm a little sour on thieves.

once upon a time, I had my bike stolen when it was my only means of rapid independent transportation. Made living rather persnickety for a while. I've been sour on thieves ever since.

about the only thief I'm prepared to slightly condone is one who steals food from a grocery store from sheer hunger. all the rest? death.


52 posted on 02/06/2006 12:55:27 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: MineralMan
Not so, by any means. See my message above. I would choose any scattergun for home defense over any handgun. Period.

Why?

53 posted on 02/06/2006 12:57:12 PM PST by Cobra64
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To: stuartcr
Yeah, I got that part too. but that wasn't what I was replying to.

If you have a firearm, but not the wherewithal to use it proactively, it's a safety blanket, nothing more. You've already put yourself into the mindset that would delay your responding to danger until the danger was overwhelming and likely unsurvivable.

Either way, you and I aren't going to see this the same.

I own my life. Entering my home means you are putting me in danger. No one has the right to endanger my life without forfeiting his.
54 posted on 02/06/2006 12:57:37 PM PST by Dr.Zoidberg (Mohammedism - Bringing you only the best of the 6th century for fourteen hundred years.)
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To: Cobra64

"Why?"

A .44" hole is nowhere near as lethal as a 2" hole. That's about the size hole a magnum load of #4 shot makes at a typical range inside a home. Virtually anywhere on the torso is a fatal shot and an immediate knockdown, and I can guarantee placement at the center of the torso.

It's a matter of choice, of course.


55 posted on 02/06/2006 1:01:29 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: chimera
Well, I did say you'd have to be a little careful about the blood trail.

So you are going to steam clean and pressure wash floors, walls and ceilings with muriatic acid?

56 posted on 02/06/2006 1:02:10 PM PST by Cobra64
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To: MineralMan
I agree with your assessment of the lethality of a shotgun at close range, my only disagreement is maneuverability of a long gun down halls and around corners.

I prefer a pistol for those times.

Well no, thats not being honest. In truth I would actually prefer a pistol grip 12 guage entry gun with a 13 inch barrel, but those are hard to explain unless you have a class 3 license.

Barring that, I'll carry my 1911.
57 posted on 02/06/2006 1:06:17 PM PST by Dr.Zoidberg (Mohammedism - Bringing you only the best of the 6th century for fourteen hundred years.)
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To: MineralMan
Acquisition and reacquisition issue. And also a fifteen round magazine versus four in the tube.

I know a lot of cops, (one of whom is a Chief of Police and personal friend,) and they all carry Glocks or Sigs in .40 S&W or .357 Sig. I wonder why. Maybe they're just stooopid. Eh?

58 posted on 02/06/2006 1:10:02 PM PST by Cobra64
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To: King Prout

You sound exactly like my economics professor. : )


59 posted on 02/06/2006 1:13:11 PM PST by Gordongekko909 (I know. Let's cut his WHOLE BODY off.)
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To: Dr.Zoidberg

Yeah, it's a matter of personal choice, I suppose. I could use my 1911, but I've decided on the Remington instead. I'm considering a Mossberg with an 18" barrel, though. They're cheap enough and very reliable shooters. Still, given the layout of my home, it doesn't really matter. It's small, and the setup works just fine with the shotgun I have on hand.

Another factor is my wife. She's not at all comfortable with the 1911, although she can shoot it fairly accurately. The shotgun, on the other hand, doesn't bother her, and she's quite good at stationary targets with it. She does complain about the recoil, but she won't have to fire it too many times, and in that situation, she won't even notice it.

I've run through some tactical drills with her in the house, so she won't be facing an unknown situation.


60 posted on 02/06/2006 1:16:06 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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