Posted on 02/01/2006 3:31:44 PM PST by RWR8189
Jo, I find that the best source on progress in Iraq is here:
http://www.brookings.edu/iraqindex
Most of it is from U.S. government sources. It's an amazing resource. You'll find that some of your indicators are out of date. Some things are heading in the right direction, but, for example, crude oil production is about where it was in September of 2003 (p. 26), oil revenue about where it was in September of '04 (p. 27), electricity at March '04 levels (28), number of judges flat since May (32). Lots more cars, but also hour-long gas lines (33). I'm confused by your reference to cell phones, as Iraq has no nationwide cell phone network any more (33). Number of newspapers down since March, water coverage 78 percent (34). Very interesting poll on 35 on the increasing near-majority who believe the country is heading int he wrong direction . Finally, note the poll numbers on 37 on how many believe the situation is getting worse, and, most frighteningly, on 39, the poll by our allies at the British defense ministry indicating that 82 percent want the coalition to leave and 45 percent who think attacks against the coalition are approrpriate.
Media portraits of discouraged Iraqi citizens and discouraged American citizens would seem appropriate, as much as we would all wish things were different.
Did you know... attributed to October 9, 2003 Coalition Provisional Authority briefing given by L. Paul Bremer and a December 8, 2003 Forbes magazine article by Caspar W. Weinberger.
**the increasing near-majority**
And this, ladies and gentlemen, shows that liberals truly do not understand democracy. It was a "near majority" that voted for John Kerry, wasn't it? But he still lost.
Did you miss the part where 82 percent want us to leave? Speaking of understanding democracy?
You mean like the cartoons that are published in the Arab media every day?
I guess that there are things that offend me more than cartoons.
You must have absolutely no sense of the history of human armed conflict. The Troop to casualty ratio over time has got to be one of the most astoundingly low in recorded history. The successful meeting of stated objectives, from toppling the Taliban, to ousting the Baathists, to establishing democratic processes has been tremendously swift.
Yet you and your ilk wail and gnash teeth because the execution has not been absolutely perfect. If you want an example of "not handled well" by civilian leaders, look to the Johnson Administration's handling of Vietnam, and the aftermath as advocated by Young Johnny Kerry. Can you say "throwing away troops for no reason but politics" and "abandoning a people to totalitarian hell"?
Um...sure, we want us to leave too. But not until we're finished. It's the question, stupid (to borrow a line from someone whose name I will not mention).
Lex, look at the Brookings Report. It's full of "stated objectives" not met.
I'm a professional historian, and wholeheartedly agree with you about Lyndon Johnson and Vietnam.
I'm just not sure ousting the Baathists, only to have them replaced by Shi'ite Islamacists allied with Iran will be a strategic gain.
See my post #62.
Most of the data are from late 2003. Having come so far, (post Saddam), Iraq may have reached a significant plateau. Measuring progress from here may take patience, as we anticipate the exciting things free and empowered people will accomplish.
We must also take into account the two recent elections as well as the success and sacrifice of the Iraqi Police.
Further, the polls said that Kerry would win.
Given time I could conduct a poll that said that 51% of Americans think that kicking puppies is good, when probably 99.999999% of Americans think it is not.
Talk to some of the young men and women returning and see what they say, just not at a Bitch in the Ditch, Moveon.idiot or Soros rally. Go talk to some real patriots. Interveiw troops retuning form the theater of war not the theater of Brokebutt Mountain.
Yes, you are CLEARLY a "liberal" as you have NO RESPECT for the rights and property of others. Following are excerpts from a statement by the founder and and owner of Free Republic.
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Your "opinion" is incorrect.......
I've been posting here for two and a half years now, and if the site owners don't want me here, they know what to do.
Like I said, the Brookings Iraq Index is "propaganda" that comes from U.S. government sources. It's a great resource, updated every month. No one's forcing you to follow it, but I find it very useful.
Does anyone else want me off the thread? Glad to oblige.
Unbelievable! You are basing your "argument" on polls and the media?
I suppose you believe the exit polls of November 2004, too.
ROTFLOL!!!
Hey Bro!
See post# 70.
I'm just not sure ousting the Baathists, only to have them replaced by Shi'ite Islamacists allied with Iran will be a strategic gain.
Howzabout we stick to what has happened instead of making dire predictions? So far, liberal predictions of dire consequences have been abysmal, from the "winter quagmire" predicted for Afghanistan onward.
It never fails to amuse me that liberals LIVE by polls. And then they wonder why we can't stand Clinton. Wasn't it Arnie who said "Leadership is not about polls. It's about making decisions."
No, don't leave the thread.
You are politely debating a losing position, but are civil as I am trying to be.
Most liberals would have been banned by now.
Maybe you are one of the few that are smart but terribly misguided.
Address post# 70 please.
So... Because you cannot agree with verifiable and accurate data, you insist that it is "propoganda". Free Republic's business is about TRUTH. What is your business here?
How come the MSM don't cover the outrageous behavior of Code Pink outside of the veteran hospital (I forgot the name) tormenting our wounded soldiers? That's even more outrageous behavior than this cartoon. Their despicable behavior should be videotaped for use in political ads later this year.
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