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To: WOSG

"IMHO we need a $15-20 per barrel oil import fee. "

You really, seriously need to study economics. Your proposal is nutts - with all due respect.

Putting a tariff (TAX) on any oil would just raise the price of ALL oil consumed in the US including domestic produced. Oil is completely fungible. The price of ALL oil in the US would try to go up by the exact amount of the tax and then it would hit the price curve and come down a BIT as marginal demand would be reduced due to a slowing economy. But price would DEFINITELY be up, it would NOT come down to pre-tax levels. Foreign countries would benefit from marginally cheaper oil prices (up to $15-20). I must repeat taxing OIL will send it up. There is NO doubt about it. We would no longer be competitive to the extent that our cost of production would go up. It is not just OPEC that is setting price. So is the Congress of these United States.

Plus, no way could you police this. A barrel of oil does not have a VIN. It all goes into a giant market. Canada would just buy it without the tariff and re-sell it to us AT THE HIGHER PRICE. XOM could do the same. Buy it from the Saudis and trans-ship it.

This is really a hair brained idea. Something I would expect from a Democrat.


382 posted on 01/28/2006 9:03:38 PM PST by Sunnyflorida
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To: Sunnyflorida

1) "Putting a tariff (TAX) on any oil would just raise the price of ALL oil consumed in the US including domestic produced. Oil is completely fungible. The price of ALL oil in the US would try to go up by the exact amount of the tax"
"But price would DEFINITELY be up, it would NOT come down to pre-tax levels."

... I never said otherwise. Oil is priced higher domestically. My point is that I WANT THAT.
I WANT us to have high-price oil and gas so we stop using it from the oil dictatorship. Result: More conservation, use of alternatives like nuclear energy, and inducements to domestic oil and gas supply. Final result: Energy independence.

A tariff on oil imports is the only way to actually acheive energy independence. We have wasted billions on subsidies of hare-brained ideas, but people keep using gas because it is there, the cheapest answer. We are better off taxing oil to the rate that it really costs us - economically and politically.

2) "We would no longer be competitive to the extent that our cost of production would go up."

This is a silly comment as it assumes that cheap oil is a pre-requisite for 'competitiveness'. Hardly. There are other forms of energy and the taxation on oil doesnt impact those, in fact it shifts the benefit to using them. For example aluminum remains as competitive, keyed off the electricity price as key determinant. That price can and would be based on nuclear, coal and NG. Further, oil is less than 1.5% of the economy. When you have something like jet fuel or gasoline now at $1.88/gal wholesale pretax, a $15 oil import fee is imposing about 35 cents on that; prices have fluctuated even more than that in 2005, so this is not a hardship that is unusual.

An economist will tell you the marginal impact ... but then back out that $20 billion tax CUT we can give to other
sectors of the economy, and it would net out a plus, because the manufacturer getting less revenue is now ... a foreign oil exporter.

This will certainly have an impact of lower oil consumption.
That is what is intended. the result will be less money being sent overseas to oil dictatorships.

3)" It is not just OPEC that is setting price. So is the Congress of these United States."

Yes, but we do this ALREADY via many other taxes, including gas taxes, income, payroll, etc. taxes. These taxes are more onerous on domestic production BY FAR than an oil tariff would be.

4) "Plus, no way could you police this. A barrel of oil does not have a VIN." Shocking statement since gas is taxed in all 50 states.

"It all goes into a giant market. Canada would just buy it without the tariff and re-sell it to us AT THE HIGHER PRICE. XOM could do the same. Buy it from the Saudis and trans-ship it."

Completely invalid point. It's not a hard concept or impractical ideal to tax oil that shows up at the ports where oil is shipped in. We'd have to deal with Canada
So the whole concept of tariffs as a whole is 'hare-brained' now. Ahem, the US basically funded the US Federal Govt for 100 years solely on tariffs,

5) "This is really a hair brained idea. Something I would expect from a Democrat."
Well, Lieberman did suggest a 50 cent gas tax.
But I'm not the only Republican woken up to a need and desire to end our dependence on foreign oil.
The events of 2005 showed us that we can suffer from high gas prices anyway. So let's bite the bullet. Tax oil imports and keep our $$$ at home.


392 posted on 01/28/2006 9:39:06 PM PST by WOSG
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