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McCain guest worker plan gets national support (We the voters have lost)
The Phoenix Business Journal ^ | 10/22/2006 | Mike Sunnucks

Posted on 01/23/2006 7:32:54 AM PST by devane617

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To: devane617
Narby = Dane

Not so sure....I haven't seen him/her making any reference to nancy pelosi or Queen Cankles yet...

81 posted on 01/23/2006 1:07:26 PM PST by Itzlzha ("The avalanche has already started...it is too late for the pebbles to vote")
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To: af_vet_rr

Something about when he had raised more money than any candidate ever had, like 18 months before the election.

And our alternative was McCain, he of McCain-Kennedy.

We really don't get much choice about how this country is governed.


82 posted on 01/23/2006 1:10:13 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Iran: We have to be cruel to be kind.)
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To: narby
Yeah. I agree. But what are you going to do with 10 million people? Do you comprehend what you're proposing?

If it even looks like there's a serious chance that an amnesty bill will pass, that number will swell by millions as people rush into the country to take advantage of it. It's happened before.

It also means that we are accepting whoever happend to come here illegally without concern if they have skills or a job. It means that we the taxpayers assume the responsibility of providing for millions that are not providing for themselves.

Mexico is not a poor country. Mexico's wealth is concentrated amoung a small number of people. Instead of their country providing for their people they are exporting their problems to the US. Mexico is a soverign country. We can't just go in and demand that they provide for better economic development and give their people a better chance to earn a living. We can't and shouldn't demand that they redistribute their wealth. However, we also shouldn't just provide for their people when they break the law and come to our country.

There are a lot of hard working people in Mexico with skills we need that are willing to come here to work. Let those who want to come apply and then we should match the ones we need with a job and invite them in for our mutual benefit.

This is why we have this problem. The left half of the country doesn't think we have a problem. And the right half of the country says "what is it you don't understand about the word 'illegal'". Neither answer will ever work. Some third way is required, or we really will lose a great deal of this country to "North Mexico".

Amnesty has been tried and failed and it made matters worse. I do realize the magnitude of the problem. I also realize that the longer we wait to address it, the harder it becomes.

This is going to be hard. It's going to be painful. It's going to be fought in the courts all the way to the supreme court. Opponents will do everything they can to delay it. They will claim that it's inhumane to deport people that are here illegally. All kinds of countries that treat their own citizens horribly will make bogus claims of human rights violations.

I don't think theire's a chance of the American people having the will to follow through on it without a guest worker program to provide legal immigration options. However, if we just grant amnesty we are accepting all to problems that are already bankrupting our state and federal governments.

We've let the problem go too far to just accept the mistakes we've made and start from there.

Even if we allow those here currently to apply, we can't allow people to stay in the guest worker program that cannot support themselves. We cannot allow their families to stay here if they can't support their families. It isn't just a problem of them breaking the law, they are also bankrupting us because we haven't restriceted immigration to people who are providing a benefit to our society.

Part of any meaningful immigration refore will need to be the requirement that we actually deport those that overstay visas and deport those unable to provide for themselves.

Neither those here illegally or those here on a guest worker program should be elligible for welfare or medicaid. If they need emergency medical care that they are unable to pay for and do not have insurance to cover, we should provide it, and then deport them.

Some elements must be border enforcement. A Guest worker program. And *real* assimilation for those who stay.

Immigrants that become citizens should be assimilated into our society and treated as everyone else in our society.

Guest workers should be treated with the same respect, and treated equally by employers, but they should not be treated identically to citizens by our government.

If you are a citizen we have safety nets of welfare and medicade in case you fall on hard times. Guest workers are not citizens and should not receive such benefits. There are here as guests and if they cannot provide a benefit to our society, that invitation should be revoked.

We should provide a path to citizenship for those that excel. However we cannot take on the problems of other governments that are not providing oppertunity for their own people unless it benefits us in the process.

83 posted on 01/23/2006 1:12:54 PM PST by untrained skeptic
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To: Itzlzha
Take a look at Narby's sig below. Need to see anymore?

by narby (Hillary! The Wicked Witch of the Left)

84 posted on 01/23/2006 1:13:20 PM PST by devane617 (An Alley-Cat mind is a terrible thing to waste)
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To: SC33

They will NOT go home when their time is up, come'on. Does anyone really believe that anyone at all would really do that if the whole environment doesn't change?


85 posted on 01/23/2006 1:15:40 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Iran: We have to be cruel to be kind.)
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To: untrained skeptic

I think there are more like 25 million illegals, btw.


86 posted on 01/23/2006 1:16:52 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Iran: We have to be cruel to be kind.)
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To: B4Ranch
I changed over and registered Independent for the last Presidential election. There's no way I'm going back. The Constitution Party can count on my vote everytime they get signed up on the ballot.

I stayed registered Republican so that I can vote against Republican incumbents in the primaries and maybe for Tom Tancredo too. But I voted for the Constitution Party in the general election and am still feeling good about it.

87 posted on 01/23/2006 1:17:55 PM PST by jackbenimble (Import the third world, become the third world)
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To: devane617
It is truly sad that we have both major parties bent on terminating the United States in favor of some sick dream of a merged USA-Mexico.

Sad too that they cannot honesty eplain their perfidy, but instead couch it in lies about "temporary" and "guest".

1776-2006: Two hundred and thirty years. Not a bad run, but it could have been a lot longer, had we gotten better leaders toward the end than the likes of Ted Kennedy, George Bush, and Bill Clinton.

88 posted on 01/23/2006 1:19:25 PM PST by dagnabbit (Vicente Fox's opening line at the Mexico-USA summit meeting: "Bring out the Gimp!")
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To: devane617
What's wrong with a 90 day guest worker program for all illegal aliens?
89 posted on 01/23/2006 1:22:39 PM PST by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: Flavius Josephus
I've heard more along the lines of about 16 million recently. I think the 10 million number was way low, but I didn't see the point in arguing about estimated numbers.

Regardless of it it's 10 million or 26 million. The problem is massive enough to bankrupt us if ignored or made legal through amnesty. It's also massive enough to make it very difficult to actually hold that many deportation hearings.

90 posted on 01/23/2006 1:23:15 PM PST by untrained skeptic
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To: af_vet_rr

Borders & Spending (Including earmarks). Pubs added fuel to the fire.


91 posted on 01/23/2006 1:23:44 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Borders & Spending (Including earmarks). Pubs added fuel to the fire.)
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To: narby
Employment rate of, what is it, 5% is that horrible? You never heard any of the stories of depression, did you?

That rate does not reflect the workers who's benefits have expired, it does not reflect the people that used to make $20 an hour with heath benefits that now make $7.50 and no benefits. That figure does not reflect those that have taken part time work because there is nothing else.

Instead let look to the words of the president. Spoken only like a man that never really had a job he said "The economy is good, the average 30 year old has had 10 jobs"

Does he really believe the average 30 yr old WANTS to have had 10 jobs? They have 10 jobs because the work disappears from under them

Ask the engineers that have seen their jobs disappear , the computer programers that now work at radio shack, the men that used to support their families with factory work .

You know Dane, sooner or later the roosters come home to roost, you may need another name so that we can hear you whine when that day comes

Ford just announced huge layoffs. But at the same time there are some "Japanese" car companies that make a higher percentage of their cars in this country than "American" companies do. So is Ford the "foreign" car company, or is Toyota the foreign car company? Since Toyota now manufactures most of it's products in the USA, I think I'll buy one of those.

The foreign manufactures do not think that Americans are too dumb or lazy as the Commerce Dept has given as a reason for companies leaving here. The actual cost difference between a Ford worker and a Foreign car maker here is about $7.00 an hour. Hardly a huge sum. Those foreign car makers get economic benefits from producing cars here as "domestic" cars AND LIGHT TRUCKS . But I am sure Congress will fix that loophole so that they will go too.

This isn't 1940. Any "real" modern war will happen so fast that if we don't have the armor in stock (and the people on duty to use it), then we just won't have it. So if it's made in England, what's the difference, except pride?

Well would you want to be "protected " by missiles that have their guidance system built by our potential enemies? Think about that for a minute.

92 posted on 01/23/2006 1:23:44 PM PST by RnMomof7 ("Sola Scriptura,Sola Christus,Sola Gratia,Sola Fide,Soli Deo Gloria)
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To: TXBSAFH

I'm not giving anybody any money this time. Money down a rat hole. Buzzards. Frickin' vultures.


93 posted on 01/23/2006 1:24:45 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Borders & Spending (Including earmarks). Pubs added fuel to the fire.)
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To: narby

What are you talking about? Since when did legal deportation to home countries equate to transporting Jews to death camps? I may have to invke Godwin's Law on you. Exporting 10 million illegals is a big job. That is why we need to get started immediately. And one more news flash... it's been many years since there was only 10 million illegals in the US.


94 posted on 01/23/2006 1:27:39 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Borders & Spending (Including earmarks). Pubs added fuel to the fire.)
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To: Flavius Josephus
Something about when he had raised more money than any candidate ever had, like 18 months before the election.

That's something I didn't think of, but it adds to it - we're not going to get the best candidates, we are going to get the candidates that can raise the most money, or that know the right people, or that look the best on TV or whatever.

Makes you wonder how many of the Founding Fathers (and even those who came after them such as Lincoln and Jackson and Teddy Roosevelt) would stand a chance of getting elected these days.
95 posted on 01/23/2006 1:27:50 PM PST by af_vet_rr
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To: devane617
They will reap what they sow, and will be replaced by someone who is fluent in Spanish. It's bound to happen.

The "guest worker" program will NOT work out. For example, will it define what the consequences will be if a "guest worker" becomes pregnant? Will we revoke her guest worker status and send her back home to give birth?

We know the answer to that one. She'll stay here, raise her anchor baby, while another comes to take her place..repeating the cycle.

We need to revisit the 14th Amendment...sigh.

96 posted on 01/23/2006 1:28:03 PM PST by spectre (Spectre's wife)
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To: Dewy

Moron.


97 posted on 01/23/2006 1:28:26 PM PST by Flavius Josephus (Borders & Spending (Including earmarks). Pubs added fuel to the fire.)
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To: narby

Did you read #73. I consider this President a total waste. He has refused to protect our borders from DAY ONE. There hasn't been any recovery work by this "wonderful Republican majority" from the damages that Clinton did while he was sitting in that same chair, so what is the advantage to having a Republican majority?

We are swamped with 20+ million illegal aliens. You name the disease that we had once eradicated and we've got it back again.

Our kids aren't getting half the education they should be in the classroom because of all the time the teachers have to spend with the Hispanic and Arabic children.

The schools are teaching our kids to think being queer is something to be proud of and other deviant sex behavior, well sure try it, you might like it.

We have a National Debt that is climbing faster than a herd of Rocky Mountain Bighorn Sheep. All the heavy manufacturing companies have gone overseas except Caterpillar. We're closing military bases left and right, except for those the UN wants us to keep of course.

There isn't much more that the Democrats could have done that the Republicans haven't allowed to happen. Just because Bush doesn't run around on his wife you think he's great. Take your argument and stuff it.


98 posted on 01/23/2006 1:29:40 PM PST by B4Ranch (No expiration date is on the Oath to protect America from all enemies, foreign and domestic.)
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To: Flavius Josephus
They will NOT go home when their time is up, come'on.

Bingo. Of course they won't. After all, who's going to make them? George Bush? ROTFLOL!!!

The illegals are already "required" to go home right now, and no one is making them do so. How on earth is anything going to be different 3, 6, or 9 years from now, when Hispanic numbers and influence have swollen even more?

No, the "temporary" and "guest" terms are just softening labels used to market these various massive permanent-amnesty and global-labor-market schemes. No one involved with this process, including the authors of these various capitulation plans, believes these words for a second.

99 posted on 01/23/2006 1:30:54 PM PST by dagnabbit (Vicente Fox's opening line at the Mexico-USA summit meeting: "Bring out the Gimp!")
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To: COEXERJ145
Perhaps if the anti-immigration crowd would stop opposting every single bill,

ILLEGAL ALIEN... IT IS NOT IMMIGRATION

sheesh!

100 posted on 01/23/2006 1:31:24 PM PST by TLI (ITINERIS IMPENDEO VALHALLA, Minuteman Project AZ Day -1 to Day 8, Texas Minutemen El Paso, 32 Days)
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