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To: ghostcat
Stone points can be surprisingly effective against metal armor

I hope you aren't serious, do you have any idea how many Indian's Cortez slaughtered in one day and how many of his fighter's he lost, excluding the few Indians helping him??? Look it up, you might learn something.

35 posted on 01/11/2006 8:17:59 PM PST by org.whodat
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To: org.whodat

Got better things to do than argue about ancient tech See ya


36 posted on 01/11/2006 8:25:58 PM PST by saganite (The poster formerly known as Arkie 2)
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To: org.whodat
Actually I Do have an idea. I also know that contrary to your statement that he only had a few Indians helping him that he had huge numbers of them. In fact Cortes success was not due to Superior weaponry rather it was due to diplomacy and duplicity.

From Bentley and Ziegler, Traditions and Encounters: A Global Perspective on the Past, Vol. II (Boston: McGraw-Hill, 2000), 596-597.

"Steel swords, muskets, cannons, and horses offered Cortés and his men some advantage over the forces they met and help to account for the Spanish conquest of the Aztec empire. Yet weaponry alone clearly would not enable Cortés’s tiny force to overcome a large, densely populated society of about twenty-one million. Quite apart from military technology, Cortés’s expedition benefited from divisions among the indigenous peoples of Mexico. With the aid of Doña Marina, the conquistadors forged alliances with peoples who resented domination by the Mexicas, the leaders of the Aztec empire, and who reinforced the small Spanish army with thousands of veteran warriors. Native allies also provided Spanish forces with logistical support and secure bases in friendly territory."

Brummett, Edgar, Hackett, Jewsbury, Taylor, Bailkey, Lewis, and Wallbank, Civilization Past and Present, Vol. II, Ninth Edition (New York: Longman, 2000), 430-431.

"Exploiting the Quetzalcoatl legend and the Aztec policy of taking sacrificial victims, Cortés was able to enlist Amerindian allies. As the little army marched inland, its members were welcomed, feasted, and given Amerindian women, including daughters of chiefs, whom Cortés distributed among his men. One woman, Malinche, later christened Doña Marina, became a valuable interpreter as well as Cortés’s mistress and bore him a son. She helped save him from a secret ambush at Cholula; it had been instigated by Montezuma, who otherwise delayed direct action as Cortés approached Tenochitlán, accompanied by thousands of Amerindian warriors.
In that city of more than 150,000 people, Cortés became a guest of Montezuma, surrounded by a host of armed Aztecs. Undaunted Cortés implemented his preconceived plan and seized the Amerindian ruler in the man’s own palace. Malinche then informed Montezuma, as if in confidence, that he must cooperate or die. The bold scheme worked temporarily, but soon the Aztecs rebelled, renounced their emperor as a traitor, stoned and killed him when he tried to pacify them, and ultimately drove a battered band of terrified Spaniards from the city in the narrowest of escapes. Later, having regrouped and gained new Amerindian allies, Cortés wore down the Aztecs in a long and bloody siege during which some Spanish prisoners were sacrificed in full view of their comrades. Finally, after fearful slaughter, some 60,000 exhausted and half-starved defenders surrendered. Most tribes in Central Mexico then accepted Spanish rule; many who resisted were enslaved."

42 posted on 01/12/2006 12:19:42 AM PST by ghostcat
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To: org.whodat; ghostcat; saganite
The Atlatl Weapon

These weapons had many names in the respective cultures in which they were used. However, they were brought to prominence because they were used successfully by the Aztec of Mexico against the Spanish in the 16th century. The name atlatl, used in the Nahuatl language spoken by the Aztecs, came to dominance in European and American literature. The Spaniards dreaded these weapons that often pierced their protective armour.

Sandstone atlatl weight

51 posted on 01/12/2006 7:12:27 PM PST by elli1
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