Posted on 01/11/2006 6:30:36 PM PST by SJackson
When it comes to deer hunting, Pennsylvania Game Commission officials prefer the atlatl to remain part of ancient history.
That's the position agency staffers are taking with a proposal that would allow hunters to pursue whitetails with atlatls, prehistoric weapons that use a wooden frame to propel 6-foot-long darts at speeds up to 80 mph.
Atlatl use dates back more than 8,000 years in Pennsylvania and far longer elsewhere in North America and Europe. The name, usually pronounced AT-lad-ul, is derived from an Aztec word for ''throwing board.''
For years, atlatl hunters in Pennsylvania have had to hone their skills in obscurity, hurling the darts at paper targets on private property and at competitions.
Their quest for legitimacy has generated a flood of interest. ''The Daily Show with Jon Stewart'' traveled to Pennsylvania for an amusing look at the sport that aired last week.
(Excerpt) Read more at mcall.com ...
Don't bow hunt - unless you are GOOD!
From Bentley and Ziegler, Traditions and Encounters: A Global Perspective on the Past, Vol. II (Boston: McGraw-Hill, 2000), 596-597.
"Steel swords, muskets, cannons, and horses offered Cortés and his men some advantage over the forces they met and help to account for the Spanish conquest of the Aztec empire. Yet weaponry alone clearly would not enable Cortés’s tiny force to overcome a large, densely populated society of about twenty-one million. Quite apart from military technology, Cortés’s expedition benefited from divisions among the indigenous peoples of Mexico. With the aid of Doña Marina, the conquistadors forged alliances with peoples who resented domination by the Mexicas, the leaders of the Aztec empire, and who reinforced the small Spanish army with thousands of veteran warriors. Native allies also provided Spanish forces with logistical support and secure bases in friendly territory."
Brummett, Edgar, Hackett, Jewsbury, Taylor, Bailkey, Lewis, and Wallbank, Civilization Past and Present, Vol. II, Ninth Edition (New York: Longman, 2000), 430-431.
"Exploiting the Quetzalcoatl legend and the Aztec policy of taking sacrificial victims, Cortés was able to enlist Amerindian allies. As the little army marched inland, its members were welcomed, feasted, and given Amerindian women, including daughters of chiefs, whom Cortés distributed among his men. One woman, Malinche, later christened Doña Marina, became a valuable interpreter as well as Cortés’s mistress and bore him a son. She helped save him from a secret ambush at Cholula; it had been instigated by Montezuma, who otherwise delayed direct action as Cortés approached Tenochitlán, accompanied by thousands of Amerindian warriors.
In that city of more than 150,000 people, Cortés became a guest of Montezuma, surrounded by a host of armed Aztecs. Undaunted Cortés implemented his preconceived plan and seized the Amerindian ruler in the man’s own palace. Malinche then informed Montezuma, as if in confidence, that he must cooperate or die. The bold scheme worked temporarily, but soon the Aztecs rebelled, renounced their emperor as a traitor, stoned and killed him when he tried to pacify them, and ultimately drove a battered band of terrified Spaniards from the city in the narrowest of escapes. Later, having regrouped and gained new Amerindian allies, Cortés wore down the Aztecs in a long and bloody siege during which some Spanish prisoners were sacrificed in full view of their comrades. Finally, after fearful slaughter, some 60,000 exhausted and half-starved defenders surrendered. Most tribes in Central Mexico then accepted Spanish rule; many who resisted were enslaved."
Never bring a spear to a musket fight...
The problem with atlatl is like the problem with banana. You can spell it but you don't know when to stop.
I guess it was kind of a cryptic answer, but I didn't think you did. Generally the decision as to legal weapons for hunting deer is based on energy deposited, but usually regulated as weapon type, mimimum muzzle velocity, 1000 fps is common, and/or bullet weight. Bows commonly by draw weight, commonly in the 50 pound range, which will correlate with speed. I'd assume a spear, which must weigh a few pounds, traveling at 100 fps would be in the bow ballpark, just figured someone who might know the weight of the spears and would do the calculation. Personally, I'd guess the objection is simply the nature of the kill, people looking at spearing a deer as barbaric, rather than any scientific basis. Along with general opposition to hunting.
i could imagine flint headed weapons being effective against a steel armoured teddy... imagine the exposion when the sparks ignite his breath!
[(speed, fpx x speed) x (weight in grains)] divided by 450,240 (gravity) gives you about 310 pounds of energy for a 2 pound spear at 100 fps. Between a .38 special and a .45 auto and 4 or 5 times most bowhunting combinations. Obviously there are other factors, but I'd have to think a spear penetrates and does significant damage. I doubt there's any scientific reason for a ban at all, simply emotional objections.
I think your right.
Ha !! Does the body come with the spear ?? lol
(I always ask this about bathingsuit ads)
Happy New Year my outdoors group. I do so enjoy all your posts.
Thanks
These weapons had many names in the respective cultures in which they were used. However, they were brought to prominence because they were used successfully by the Aztec of Mexico against the Spanish in the 16th century. The name atlatl, used in the Nahuatl language spoken by the Aztecs, came to dominance in European and American literature. The Spaniards dreaded these weapons that often pierced their protective armour.
Sandstone atlatl weight
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