[robertpaulsen]

"It wasn't a mistake to create a Constitutional Representative Republic when one had never existed, credibility be damned."

But one WAS created, unlike a Harm vs. No Harm government which has yet to see the light of day anywhere in the world in all of recorded history.

" Popularity is rarely a good indicator of justice or worth."

No, but coupled with longevity it comes closer.

"It's Illegal because it's Immoral"

Who claims that? Granted, most of our laws concern immoral behavior, but many immoral acts remain legal. It used to be that people were restrained from immoral acts by their own sense of decency and self esteem. That's been replaced by a selfish, hedonistic, individualistic "if it's legal I can do it and don't you dare criticize me" attitude. Hence, all the laws.

"It's Immoral because it's Illegal"

It immoral because it debases Man, and we're better than that.

[Durus]

But one WAS created, unlike a Harm vs. No Harm government which has yet to see the light of day anywhere in the world in all of recorded history.
Yet one could make the argument that our government was created based on that concept.

No, but coupled with longevity it comes closer.

So if it's popular for a long time then it's "closer" to moral? So based on that abortion must be gaining morality.

Who claims that? Granted, most of our laws concern immoral behavior, but many immoral acts remain legal. It used to be that people were restrained from immoral acts by their own sense of decency and self esteem. That's been replaced by a selfish, hedonistic, individualistic "if it's legal I can do it and don't you dare criticize me" attitude. Hence, all the laws.

You certainly suggested that most laws are created to stem immoral behavior. The increase of laws in our country does not historically match increased licentiousness but increased "do-gooder" power (or suffrage if there is a difference). Once people decided that their wishes did not have to conform to the constitutionally delegated powers of the government out country has been going down hill. There was a time when the absence of a delegated power was just as much of a limit on government as an amendment in the BOR but that time is long past and with it went individual responsibility.